Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

[arakeretzig]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

For years, especially since Berlusconi has been in power in Italy, Russia, Italy and Turkey have been closely co-operating in gas delivery projects, under the Black Sea to Turkey, with an onward extension to Italy.

Should Armenia join this lucrative project? Armenia then becomes a business partner to Turkey, meaning Turkey has to moderate its politics in the Caucasus. And Italy opens up to Armenian businesses

I don't think it's a bad idea, it will do us more good than bad. That border should be opened someday anyway.

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

...
Should Armenia join this lucrative project? Armenia then becomes a business partner to Turkey, meaning Turkey has to moderate its politics in the Caucasus. And Italy opens up to Armenian businesses

Armenia has nothing to offer in that pack......and any such partnership with Turkey cannot be until Turkey starts acting responsibly with its neighbors and opens the borders without any preconditions for starters.

Armenia should continue to present itself as an alternative route from Turkey for the Iranian oil and gas export to Europe and beyond, Russia agrees.

[lampron]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Turkish businessmen are ahead of Turkish politicians! 100 or 200 years ago it was Armenians, Greeks, xxxs, Levantines (those descended from European settlers ) dominating Ottoman (Turkish) trade. Today Turks have woken up to becoming big-time traders. So Armenian participation is bound to have an impact on politics.

Armenian construction, civil and gas engineering firms must have something to offer and benefit from the multi-billion dollar transactions

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Turkish businessmen are ahead of Turkish politicians! 100 or 200 years ago it was Armenians, Greeks, xxxs, Levantines (those descended from European settlers ) dominating Ottoman (Turkish) trade. Today Turks have woken up to becoming big-time traders. So Armenian participation is bound to have an impact on politics.

Armenian construction, civil and gas engineering firms must have something to offer and benefit from the multi-billion dollar transactions

Agreed, business is business (as long as your butt is covered) but the overall Turkish point of view is that Armenian economy has nothing significant to offer compared to their current massive economic trades with other nations (a drop in the bucket if you will)..........not to mention alienating and going against their little brother’s wishes, the Azeris.

However even the top Turkish politicans realize the stratigic advantages of being a dominating economic force in the region regardless of the countries that they have listed on that "Black List" of them.

[arakeretzig]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Agreed, business is business (as long as your butt is covered) but the overall Turkish point of view is that Armenian economy has nothing significant to offer compared to their current massive economic trades with other nations (a drop in the bucket if you will)..........not to mention alienating and going against their little brother’s wishes, the Azeris.

However even the top Turkish politicans realize the stratigic advantages of being a dominating economic force in the region regardless of the countries that they have listed on that "Black List" of them.

I read a recent study that said the advantages for Armenia for opening the border is negligable, since Armenia doesn't have that big of a market anyways.
But it could give the impovrished eastern anatolia more jobs and more income. That's for sure.
So mostly, it's for their advantage.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

I read a recent study that said the advantages for Armenia for opening the border is negligable, since Armenia doesn't have that big of a market anyways.
But it could give the impovrished eastern anatolia more jobs and more income. That's for sure.
So mostly, it's for their advantage.

Basically, the two governments would benefit from slave labor on both sides of the border.

[lampron]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Agreed, business is business (as long as your butt is covered) but the overall Turkish point of view is that Armenian economy has nothing significant to offer compared to their current massive economic trades with other nations (a drop in the bucket if you will)..........not to mention alienating and going against their little brother’s wishes, the Azeris.

However even the top Turkish politicans realize the stratigic advantages of being a dominating economic force in the region regardless of the countries that they have listed on that "Black List" of them.

But Russia is the big player in all of this. Russia is interested in an improvement in relations between Turkey and Armenia. Armenian businessmen will enter this project with the support of Russia.

In the long term Russia, Turkey and Iran may form a loose economic union. The EU is unhappy about a competing entity to the east, led by Russia. That is why it is in a hurry to encourage Serbia, Belarus to join it and in spite of strong opposition in some places, EU strategic planners still want to bring Turkey into the EU

[retro]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

But Russia is the big player in all of this. Russia is interested in an improvement in relations between Turkey and Armenia. Armenian businessmen will enter this project with the support of Russia.

In the long term Russia, Turkey and Iran may form a loose economic union. The EU is unhappy about a competing entity to the east, led by Russia. That is why it is in a hurry to encourage Serbia, Belarus to join it and in spite of strong opposition in some places, EU strategic planners still want to bring Turkey into the EU

How are Turko-Russian bilateral trade relations any of your concern and why would Russia involve you in it's affairs?

Regional instability isn't in European strategic interests and the EU if anything is keen access to Western Asian export markets.

[lampron]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

How are Turko-Russian bilateral trade relations any of your concern

Turco-Russian relations are obviously of great interest to Armenia. Look at the map and look at the history of the last 200 years!

and why would Russia involve you in it's affairs?

Armenia and Russia are in the CSTO and there is history going back 200+ years. That means, they have been 'involved' in each others affairs for a long time. You need to do some reading before you post next time!!!

[gegev]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

There are rumors that Russia is going to allow Armenia to import Iranian cheap gas (for public use, in addition to the gas for electricity generation) instead of its expensive one. Perhaps Russians realize that the economic rape can’t support their long range plans in the Caucasus; in terms of having Armenia as a reliable ally there in future.

Who knows the details?