Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

[kurdman]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

So we got a state where Turkey has bases in and can increase their bases any moment it wants. Also a state that will host an American base in the future, because the Americans will not drop the ball on an opportunity like this. So how is it in our interest to support such a country I don't get it?

Please tell me what are those fascistic Kurdish policies.

Please read previous posts before making stupid comments, we can not logically ask the Turks to leave while refusing to make the PKK leave, we will not have any countries backing on this becuase it does not make sense, and no the Turks can't just increase man power if they want, lol.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

So we got a state where Turkey has bases in and can increase their bases any moment it wants. Also a state that will host an American base in the future, because the Americans will not drop the ball on an opportunity like this. So how is it in our interest to support such a country I don't get it?

Please tell me what are those fascistic Kurdish policies.

[kurdman]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

Iraqi kurdistan better than Armenia? On what level? That you have some oil, are part of a fake country that was put together in the 20s. How many people can read and write in iraqi kurdistan? How many doctors per 1000 people? How many schools per 1000 people? how many higher level educational institutions? I could go on and on.

In the 90's Kurdistan had 2 universities, today it has 20, and many more U/C, we also have an american university, with American lecturers. Our government has a $100 million budget a year which is spent on sending the top 2 students from every school to the best universities abroad and we have agreements with EU and US in this regard.

Since 2005, we've built 3000 new schools, and many international private schools. the illiterate rate is low, but high among the older generation 60+ as their lives as been mostly in war time, since 2005 we've built 100's of local hospitals, and tens of big hospitals.

i.e. (Just a small examples, and there are many more where this came from) - This is a hospital by the way, there are tens more big hospitals U/C.

You come here, insult Armenians and Armenia, spread your nationalist bs and then expect others to play nice and take your views as the Gospel.

Your all running away from the truth which is Armenia as a fascist Kurdish policy, while we do not have a fascist policy for Armenians or Assyrians, so who's the 'nationalist' here?

Goodluck with the nation building process, you guys will need it, and see what happens when the Americans and israelis decide or are compelled to stop supporting iraqi kurdistan.

1- We don't have Israeli support, it's all propaganda.
2- American support is very limited and it's to Iraq as a whole and not especially for Kurdistan, we have oil + 375,000 soldiers, so nothing is going to happen.

P.S:

- Many tourist companies have included Kurdistan in their top tourist destinations.
- Top gear visited Kurdistan in their Christmas special, and spent 30 (show-time) minutes there.

[Armanen]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

Iraqi kurdistan better than Armenia? On what level? That you have some oil, are part of a fake country that was put together in the 20s. How many people can read and write in iraqi kurdistan? How many doctors per 1000 people? How many schools per 1000 people? how many higher level educational institutions? I could go on and on.

You come here, insult Armenians and Armenia, spread your nationalist bs and then expect others to play nice and take your views as the Gospel.

Goodluck with the nation building process, you guys will need it, and see what happens when the Americans and israelis decide or are compelled to stop supporting iraqi kurdistan.

[kurdman]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

I will say again. Would you go to the Balkans and tell everybody (Croats, Bosnians, Montenegrins) that they are Serbs? Of course not! They are all the "same people" but because of religion and other factors to a lesser extent, there are visible differences amongst them, and because of that they have been slaughtering each other for lands (fortunately it's over). - same goes for Yazidis - I am not denying that they are very much connected with Kurds in terms of ethnicity and also history - but the religious difference is very key as religion is essential in identity and its effect on culture. There are many instances of ethnic groups being divided on this basis - you should know this.

Is your brain compromised? how many times should I repeat this?

40,000 Confused Yazidis vs 500,000 Nationalist Kurdish Yazidis in south, who wins? all you need to admit is that your government has a fascist policy when it comes to Kurds in it's state and promotes division, it's not hard you know, all you have to do is find someone that would sell their dignity for some money, give them money and make them spread propaganda. As you can see from the links below there are no differences between Muslim and Yazidi Kurds (In fact, there has never been division between Kurds becuase of religion, there are many nationalist Kurdish xxxs), however there are issues in Armenia, promoted by the government, which is reflected in your attitude to the topic.

Dohuk, Feb. 20 (AKnews) – An Iraqi Yazidi MP is planning to sue a Lebanese TV channel for alleged “insults” to the Yazidis after it aired a show about the faith.

The MP says she will seek a formal apology and financial compensation from the satellite broadcaster on charges of “deliberate abuse” of the Yazidi religion in one of the station’s programs.

Lebanon’s Mustaqbal Channel aired a show “Sireh Wanfatahat” hosting former commissioned Minister of the Arab League Ziad Fleifel who talked about the origin of the Yazidis and their faith.

Mr. Fleifel said in the show that the Yazidis were originally Arabs who later became Kurds. But Dakhil wants to sue him for “deliberate mocking” of the Yazidi beliefs, customs and traditions “in a way that showed complete ignorance.”

Dakhil is expected to file her lawsuit to the Lebanese judiciary as the defendants are Lebanese. She says she will, in the case of winning damages, distribute the money to poor Yezidi families or print brochures to explain the Yezidi faith.

Yezidis consider themselves to be Kurds. They speak Kurdish, dress similar to Kurds and have sacred religious books solely in the Kurdish language.

According to unofficial statistics, there are around half a million Yezidis in Iraq and the Kurdistan region.

Reported by Khudr Khallat

Rn/Ry/Ka/AKnews

“The Yazidis are saying their praying in Kurdish language, their religious, social, and the history of the Yazidis are clear remarks that they are Kurds”, general director of Yazidis affairs at the KRG- Ministry of Endowments and Religious Affairs, Khairi Buzani said.

“The Yazidis had their say at the Iraqi March 7 poll and prove to be Kurds. Also the Yazidis spiritual council, the largest authority of the Yazidis, has confirmed that the Yazidis are Kurds and all of the Yazidi personalities have to condemn such sort of statements”, Buzani added.

We get 7 seat worth from Yazidi voters! which is around 350,000 votes.

Also the highest Yazidi emir stated that they are Kurds, and Yazidis listen to what their religious leaders say.

Yezidi Emir, Tahsin Saeid Bek has said that there will be no compromise on the Kurdish origins of the religious minority and has praised the Kurdistan Regional Government for officially recognizing Yezidi religious holidays. yazidi

Tahsin was addressing an audience of Kurds living in Germany and Holland in the Dutch city of Mira, according to a report published by the Lalish Yezidi website on Monday.

http://www.aknews.com/en/aknews/1/194338/

We are aware of your plans, and mark my word, you will fail... we just need to fund the Yazidis properly as many Yazidis from Armenia visit the Lalish temple in Duhok, this way we can re-assimilate them easily.

Well Iraqi Kurdistan may have a good deal of autonomy, but it's not officially independent, it's not a separate state. And last time I checked, Kurds in Turkey are still living under Turkish government. So by definition, your people are still "stateless'.

You can label it as you like, the fact is that our situation is better than most independent countries (including Armenia) becuase we have the rights of an independent country + Access to Iraqi issues, and the protection of a 'federal region'

[Mos]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

First of all I didn't open this thread, so what makes you think that I want Armenian support? it's quite pathetic how you make stupid statements like 'Yeah they might be Kurds, but their not becuase their not Muslim' what's your IQ? every Kurd was Yazidi before the force of Islam, besides like I told you, there are only 40,000 Yazidi in Armenia and 500,000 in south Kurdistan, and so what you say or think, or what ever crap you put into the foolish minds of the Yazidi, it still does not change the fact that they are Kurds.

stateless Kurds? South Kurdistan is independent, in ways that you can't imagine, because no Arab can enter our region without our premision, we however knew that an 'independent' Kurdistan on Maps, will be very much 'dependent' on it's neighbors (As you are) and we decided that if we stick in Iraq, it would make us way more significant becuase we have influence on Baghdad politics too, while retaining all the rights of an independent nation.

Mate, we don't need you to do anything.. like I said, it does not affect our plans one bit.

@bell-the-cat

Haha, you are so funny, who's that then? we have 20 different dialects and we all consider ourselves to be Kurds, for example in one town you'd find Kurmanji, sorani, feyli Kurds and we have no problems, I myself am a sorani Kurd, and come from slemani province, if however I went to duhok everyone would be kurmanji, so your efforts are pointless and you have no evidence, just stupid statements made from an ignorant person.

I will say again. Would you go to the Balkans and tell everybody (Croats, Bosnians, Montenegrins) that they are Serbs? Of course not! They are all the "same people" but because of religion and other factors to a lesser extent, there are visible differences amongst them, and because of that they have been slaughtering each other for lands (fortunately it's over). - same goes for Yazidis - I am not denying that they are very much connected with Kurds in terms of ethnicity and also history - but the religious difference is very key as religion is essential in identity and its effect on culture. There are many instances of ethnic groups being divided on this basis - you should know this.

Well Iraqi Kurdistan may have a good deal of autonomy, but it's not officially independent, it's not a separate state. And last time I checked, Kurds in Turkey are still living under Turkish government. So by definition, your people are still "stateless'.

[kurdman]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

Although I am a supporter of Kurds and an independent Kurdistan, you have been clearly making some big mistakes. I don't want to go into the history of Kurds, but it is a fact they are made up of several largely nomadic tribes. Never in history did such a thing as "Kurdistan" exist, but there is a time for everything. Also, most of the "claims" of "historical" Kurdish lands are incorrect.

If Kurds will manage to get an independent Kurdistan, it will only be because of their large numbers inhabiting ancient historical lands which mostly belong to Assyrians and other, much older nations (Persia, Armenia).

And don't overestimate the "independence" of Kurdistan, talking "tough" about how Arabs can not enter your region, meanwhile there are dozens of Turkish soldiers stationed inside Iraqi-Kurdistan, insulting your independence and de-facto occupying your "country".

We have the same common enemy, the Turks, and between Kurds and Armenians we have to figure our differences out. Most of the people on this forum are lead by emotions, "you don't like me, I don't like you, nanana, we don't want you", but fortunately real politics is not lead by emotions but by common interests.

There have been a lot of influential Armenians contributing to Kurdish culture (Aram Tigran) or giving their lives for the struggle of an independent Kurdistan. Nothing more to add.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=un5ec3ieMYs

Your completely wrong about the historical aspect, however this is a political post so I will only discuss politics, besides that I'm not really interested in politics.

First of all, yes there are Turkish bases that were built in the 90's for 'peace', however now they have no legitimate reason to stay and we could make them leave, however that means making the PKK leave too, and as long as the PKK, they have a 'legitimate' reason to stay, and we can't argue about that on the political front, besides they can't mobilize their troops without getting premision first:

In one incident, a senior Iraqi Kurdish official said Peshmerga soldiers stopped Turkish tanks from leaving a base just inside Kurdistan 'northern Iraq'. Turkey has kept small contingents of troops in northern Iraq since earlier offensives in the 1990s.

http://www.ekurd.net/mismas/articles/misc2008/2/government1348.htm

The Iraqi army is not allowed in Kurdistan, and we have borders with Arab Iraq, however there are Kurdish soldiers all over Iraq, including the Iraqi army which is in our advantage as in case of war the Iraqi army will have in-fighting and deserters.

10,000 Peshmerga in Baghdad. http://www.rudaw.net/english/kurds/3388.html

[Joseph]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

Although I am a supporter of Kurds and an independent Kurdistan, you have been clearly making some big mistakes. I don't want to go into the history of Kurds, but it is a fact they are made up of several largely nomadic tribes. Never in history did such a thing as "Kurdistan" exist, but there is a time for everything. Also, most of the "claims" of "historical" Kurdish lands are incorrect.

If Kurds will manage to get an independent Kurdistan, it will only be because of their large numbers inhabiting ancient historical lands which mostly belong to Assyrians and other, much older nations (Persia, Armenia).

And don't overestimate the "independence" of Kurdistan, talking "tough" about how Arabs can not enter your region, meanwhile there are dozens of Turkish soldiers stationed inside Iraqi-Kurdistan, insulting your independence and de-facto occupying your "country".

We have the same common enemy, the Turks, and between Kurds and Armenians we have to figure our differences out. Most of the people on this forum are lead by emotions, "you don't like me, I don't like you, nanana, we don't want you", but fortunately real politics is not lead by emotions but by common interests.

There have been a lot of influential Armenians contributing to Kurdish culture (Aram Tigran) or giving their lives for the struggle of an independent Kurdistan. Nothing more to add.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=un5ec3ieMYs

I agree 100%. I support a Kurdish state and realize we have a common, powerful and evil enemy and this common enemy will ultimately be endangered as developments slip out of their control ( I would hope that the PKK is getting more support from Kurds in Northern Iraq but this does not appear to be happening). While I hope that Kurdistan develops and replaces Turkey as the US/Israeli client state in the region- which is already happening- I think it will take generations to even begin to trust the Kurds after what they did to Armenians and Assyrians. For centuries they based their entire livelihood on the plunder and massacre of largely unarmed and peaceful Christians in hamlets, villages and towns throughout Asia Minor. They were the willing murderers for both Abdul Hamid II and then the CUP and to somehow expect us to join/support their struggle is insulting. Why would we ever trust them? Like I said, this will take generations. I wish no ill-will towards the Kurds but I can never forget what they did to my family Kharberd at the behest of the Turks. BTW, the only Kurds who seemed to help Armenians were the Dersim- Kurds that were once Armenians and then largely eradicated by Ataturk in the 1920's.

[Tigranakert]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

First of all I didn't open this thread, so what makes you think that I want Armenian support? it's quite pathetic how you make stupid statements like 'Yeah they might be Kurds, but their not becuase their not Muslim' what's your IQ? every Kurd was Yazidi before the force of Islam, besides like I told you, there are only 40,000 Yazidi in Armenia and 500,000 in south Kurdistan, and so what you say or think, or what ever crap you put into the foolish minds of the Yazidi, it still does not change the fact that they are Kurds.

stateless Kurds? South Kurdistan is independent, in ways that you can't imagine, because no Arab can enter our region without our premision, we however knew that an 'independent' Kurdistan on Maps, will be very much 'dependent' on it's neighbors (As you are) and we decided that if we stick in Iraq, it would make us way more significant becuase we have influence on Baghdad politics too, while retaining all the rights of an independent nation.

Mate, we don't need you to do anything.. like I said, it does not affect our plans one bit.

@bell-the-cat

Haha, you are so funny, who's that then? we have 20 different dialects and we all consider ourselves to be Kurds, for example in one town you'd find Kurmanji, sorani, feyli Kurds and we have no problems, I myself am a sorani Kurd, and come from slemani province, if however I went to duhok everyone would be kurmanji, so your efforts are pointless and you have no evidence, just stupid statements made from an ignorant person.

Although I am a supporter of Kurds and an independent Kurdistan, you have been clearly making some big mistakes. I don't want to go into the history of Kurds, but it is a fact they are made up of several largely nomadic tribes. Never in history did such a thing as "Kurdistan" exist, but there is a time for everything. Also, most of the "claims" of "historical" Kurdish lands are incorrect.

If Kurds will manage to get an independent Kurdistan, it will only be because of their large numbers inhabiting ancient historical lands which mostly belong to Assyrians and other, much older nations (Persia, Armenia).

And don't overestimate the "independence" of Kurdistan, talking "tough" about how Arabs can not enter your region, meanwhile there are dozens of Turkish soldiers stationed inside Iraqi-Kurdistan, insulting your independence and de-facto occupying your "country".

We have the same common enemy, the Turks, and between Kurds and Armenians we have to figure our differences out. Most of the people on this forum are lead by emotions, "you don't like me, I don't like you, nanana, we don't want you", but fortunately real politics is not lead by emotions but by common interests.

There have been a lot of influential Armenians contributing to Kurdish culture (Aram Tigran) or giving their lives for the struggle of an independent Kurdistan. Nothing more to add.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=un5ec3ieMYs

[kurdman]

Re: Prospects of a Kurdish state and what it means for Armenia

First of all I didn't open this thread, so what makes you think that I want Armenian support? it's quite pathetic how you make stupid statements like 'Yeah they might be Kurds, but their not becuase their not Muslim' what's your IQ? every Kurd was Yazidi before the force of Islam, besides like I told you, there are only 40,000 Yazidi in Armenia and 500,000 in south Kurdistan, and so what you say or think, or what ever crap you put into the foolish minds of the Yazidi, it still does not change the fact that they are Kurds.

stateless Kurds? South Kurdistan is independent, in ways that you can't imagine, because no Arab can enter our region without our premision, we however knew that an 'independent' Kurdistan on Maps, will be very much 'dependent' on it's neighbors (As you are) and we decided that if we stick in Iraq, it would make us way more significant becuase we have influence on Baghdad politics too, while retaining all the rights of an independent nation.

Mate, we don't need you to do anything.. like I said, it does not affect our plans one bit.

@bell-the-cat

Haha, you are so funny, who's that then? we have 20 different dialects and we all consider ourselves to be Kurds, for example in one town you'd find Kurmanji, sorani, feyli Kurds and we have no problems, I myself am a sorani Kurd, and come from slemani province, if however I went to duhok everyone would be kurmanji, so your efforts are pointless and you have no evidence, just stupid statements made from an ignorant person.