The Western Armenian Language Thread

[ARGENTINA]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

How are Armenians in Turkey doing? Thats a great website, it looks like they are staying strong. What was your personal experience Argentina?

on contrary of a lot of flashy named participants in this forum who mostly detest armenians in turkey ( some of them even have the ignorance of calling them traitors) I can say lots of ideas and political and administrative theories about turkish armenians that I have read here dont reflect any reasonable and logic truth whatsoever.Some of them declared if armenians in turkey have no value at all,imagine in what state of mind one could find himself to declare that ,well lets put this aside for a moment .Armenians in turkey are struggling to be fine it is not easy ,Turkey is not USA nor Argentine for them,life could be unbearable but every time there could be found a easy solution to overcome difficulties .Argentine on the other side is my second homeland I like it a lot, Argentine and her way of life is just harmoniously terrific. Why I feel so close because your surroundings gives you something unconsciously which enriches your life quality for better

[yerazhishda]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

How are Armenians in Turkey doing? Thats a great website, it looks like they are staying strong. What was your personal experience Argentina?

on contrary of a lot of flashy named participants in this forum who mostly detest armenians in turkey ( some of them even have the ignorance of calling them traitors) I can say lots of ideas and political and administrative theories about turkish armenians that I have read here dont reflect any reasonable and logic truth whatsoever.Some of them declared if armenians in turkey have no value at all,imagine in what state of mind one could find himself to declare that ,well lets put this aside for a moment .Armenians in turkey are struggling to be fine it is not easy ,Turkey is not USA nor Argentine for them,life could be unbearable but every time there could be found a easy solution to overcome difficulties .Argentine on the other side is my second homeland I like it a lot, Argentine and her way of life is just harmoniously terrific. Why I feel so close because your surroundings gives you something unconsciously which enriches your life quality for better

This is a language thread concerning questions about Western Armenian. If you don't want to post on that topic, go somewhere else.

[ARGENTINA]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

This is a language thread concerning questions about Western Armenian. If you don't want to post on that topic, go somewhere else.

read once again ,think twice ,finally count three before writing will make more sense for everyone.The western armenian language is more attractive and has lot work done in it because the center of armenian culture was in Istanbul and promenant armenian writers emerged from anatolian and isatnbul land.All languages evolve and are made of many dialects, and Armenian is not an exception. Armenians in Karabakh have a different dialect than Armenians in Yerevan, while Armenians in Persia speak Armenian with some phonetic characteristics associated with Persian. The two main variants today are “Western Armenian”, spoken mainly by Armenians raised outside of Armenia and “Eastern Armenian” spoken by Armenians raised in Armenia, Iran and the states of the ex-USSR. There are many historic reasons for this division in two variants, namely the establishment of a Western-oriented Armenian kingdom in Cilicia in the Middle Ages, away from the Armenian homeland, and more recently, attempts by the USSR to assimilate Armenians. There are notable differences between the two, especially on the exact pronunciation of consonants, although both have differences with traditional Armenian. In short, , the orthography and spelling of Western Armenian is more in line with the original Armenian alphabet, as defined by its inventor Mesrop Mashtots. What the Armenian language needs is a revival. The Western Armenian spelling, Alphabet structure and pronunciation of vowels must be imposed, while the Eastern Armenian pronunciation of consonants must be kept. Hence one language can be used, and an Armenian named “Daniel” or “Abraham” does not have to be called “Taniel” or “Apraham” by other Armenians. If Armenians around the world can not even agree on something so fundamental as the type of language that they will speak, how can they agree on a common vision for the prosperity, enlightenment and flourishing of the Armenian ethnic identity? This type of linguistic inconsistency contributes to alienate Armenians further from the Armenian identity.

[yerazhishda]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

read once again ,think twice ,finally count three before writing will make more sense for everyone.The western armenian language is more attractive and has lot work done in it because the center of armenian culture was in Istanbul and promenant armenian writers emerged from anatolian and isatnbul land.All languages evolve and are made of many dialects, and Armenian is not an exception. Armenians in Karabakh have a different dialect than Armenians in Yerevan, while Armenians in Persia speak Armenian with some phonetic characteristics associated with Persian. The two main variants today are “Western Armenian”, spoken mainly by Armenians raised outside of Armenia and “Eastern Armenian” spoken by Armenians raised in Armenia, Iran and the states of the ex-USSR. There are many historic reasons for this division in two variants, namely the establishment of a Western-oriented Armenian kingdom in Cilicia in the Middle Ages, away from the Armenian homeland, and more recently, attempts by the USSR to assimilate Armenians. There are notable differences between the two, especially on the exact pronunciation of consonants, although both have differences with traditional Armenian. In short, , the orthography and spelling of Western Armenian is more in line with the original Armenian alphabet, as defined by its inventor Mesrop Mashtots. What the Armenian language needs is a revival. The Western Armenian spelling, Alphabet structure and pronunciation of vowels must be imposed, while the Eastern Armenian pronunciation of consonants must be kept. Hence one language can be used, and an Armenian named “Daniel” or “Abraham” does not have to be called “Taniel” or “Apraham” by other Armenians. If Armenians around the world can not even agree on something so fundamental as the type of language that they will speak, how can they agree on a common vision for the prosperity, enlightenment and flourishing of the Armenian ethnic identity? This type of linguistic inconsistency contributes to alienate Armenians further from the Armenian identity.

What does this cut-and-paste job (you wouldn't know all this because you're a Turk) have to do with you posting non-language posts in this thread?

P.S. I'm tired of people acting like Western and Eastern are two different languages! 9 times out of 10 it's mutually intelligible! There are differences in grammar which is why I started this thread.

[Lucin]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

Yeah I should've mentioned. Iran survived the Soviet reform of the Mesrobian orthography so it's the last place where all Eastern Armenian speakers know and use Mesrobian only

I used to read a lot from Armenian websites in sovietized Armenian but now I really try to avoid reading Armenian sites (from Armenia) as sometimes I end up mixing it with Mesropian orthography that I have been taught. Like, Յ or հ/ ւ or վ / է or ե/ ո or օ. There is a rule on where to put which but it can't be applied to some words.

What does this cut-and-paste job (you wouldn't know all this because you're a Turk) have to do with you posting non-language posts in this thread?

I don't think he is a Turk.

P.S. I'm tired of people acting like Western and Eastern are two different languages! 9 times out of 10 it's mutually intelligible! There are differences in grammar which is why I started this thread.

Those (WAs or EAs) who complain about not understanding either of the dialects should simply improve their Armenian. If you know/ speak either of the dialects properly then you can definitely understand the other.

the orthography and spelling of Western Armenian is more in line with the original Armenian alphabet, as defined by its inventor Mesrop Mashtots.

Really? Is this true? I was always wondering which dialect is closer to Classic Armenian, in terms of grammar as well as pronunciation. What's the reasoning?

[Armenian]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

I don't think he is a Turk.

He is a Turk, or worst, a problematic Turkahai. He has been here and banned from here under several other names in the past.

Regarding language: The Soviet authorities in Armenia attempted to 'simplify' the language for the peasantry when they butchered the Mesrobian grammar. Simplify the grammar, they did. However, they also achieved something more sinister in doing so, they drove a further wedge between Diaspora/western Armenians and Soviet Armenians. I believe that sooner or later Mesrobian will come back. If it does not it's not the end of the world. Moreover, some Armenian linguists say that Western Armenian has preserved a grammar that is closest to Classical Armenian (Grabar), while Eastern Armenian has preserved pronunciations that are closest to Grabar.

[Lucin]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

He is a Turk, or worst, a problematic Turkahai. He has been here and banned from here under several other names in the past.

Okay.

(I do not read many threads lately.)

Regarding language: The Soviet authorities in Armenia attempted to 'simplify' the language for the peasantry when they butchered the Mesrobian grammar. Simplify the grammar, they did.

You mean the orthography, right? Because the grammar has not changed.

I hope it will return to its Mesropian version eventually, but I do not obsess over it either. It's just the wedge that it has created which is annoying and some more annoying people who just find it as an excuse to belittle each other further.

However, they also achieved something more sinister in doing so, they drove a further wedge between Diaspora/western Armenians and Soviet Armenians. I believe that sooner or later Mesrobian will come back. If it does not it's not the end of the world. Moreover, some Armenian linguists say that Western Armenian has preserved a grammar that is closest to Classical Armenian (Grabar), while Eastern Armenian has preserved pronunciations that are closest to Grabar.

Interesting.

[Federate]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

Sadly, I think the damage may end up being permanent. Soviet Armenian grammar is so 'simplified' that people will not be willing to revert to the more complex (relative to SAO) Mesrobian orthography. And the feeling that I get from RoA citizens is that they would not want to go back to the old orthography and are happy with this one.

Oh, and the damage is so severe that some Armenians even get insulted when you call the 'reforms' "Soviet orthography". Some people even think Mesrobian is outdated and that it's only a Western Armenian thing.

[truAnatolian]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

LoL... not as out-dated as Soviet-policies, thats for sure.

[ARGENTINA]

Re: The Western Armenian Language Thread

He is a Turk, or worst, a problematic Turkahai..

And what is this ?