Armenian lesbians/gays

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Obviously if a woman or any person for that matter is beat up for no reason, then the necessary laws apply. That being said, if a woman begins flirting with other men, if she becomes promiscuous, or out-right disrespectful, violence against such women becomes natural and often justified. I don't like though when outside people begin prying into other families' business and marital relations. All that should stay within the family and be a private matter. Often such feminists begin with such propaganda in order to push their agenda which includes breaking the culture that woman should become wives/mothers.

And what if the husband becomes promiscuous and flirts with other women? Armenian husbands are notorious for seeking "outside help" when their wives are pregnant or otherwise unable or unavailable for sex.

Women who have children will not easily start sleeping around. A woman will do that out of desperation. On the other hand, if you have marriages that are arranged with the hope that a woman will grow to love the man she marries, you are setting up for all kinds of problems.

Recently a woman was killed by her husband and mother in law, in the spirit of keeping things private and within the family.

Fighting against domestic violence is not a Feminist cause. It's a human rights issue. When a woman reveals that she's been the victim of domestic violence it is considered shameful (amot), but it is not shameful that a man doesn't have enough self-respect and honor to control himself. And what about the boys who watch their dads beating their moms? Won't they grow into cowardly, spineless men like their woman-beating dads? The whole thing is a$$-backwards!

There is NO VALID REASON for a man to beat a woman or a child.

Also, the Feminist movement is a very diverse one. Yes, there are feminists who view marriage and motherhood as destructive to women. But most feminists are fighting for equal access to universal rights to life, liberty, freedom of speech and expression, and the pursuit of happiness in whatever way is meaningful to the individual woman. So, most feminists have deep respect for women who choose to marry and become mothers. They may not go down that road, but there is room for all kinds of choices. To say that fighting against domestic violence is tantamount to threatening marriage and motherhood... there's something seriously effed up about that kind of broad sweeping conflation. We would then have to say that domestic violence should be a natural and expected part of marriage and motherhood, which also makes no sense...

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

More anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda. I guess they would be advocating that a man lose all his authority in the household? I guess be in favour of having the woman be able sell herself to every other man that gives her some coins?

As to the poverty, yes some people do live like that, it's unfortunate reality that should be addressed (and is slowly being done so), but in every country/society you have such desolate poverty, especially in post-Soviet countries.

You seem to be suggesting that a woman, any woman, who isn't placed under a man's control and surveillance would immediately and easily start sleeping with random men and accepting money for it. That's a very paranoid and skewed world view to live by. Some African cultures (Sudan, Mali, Senegal, and others) believe this also, and that is why little girls as young as 3 years old are taken to the local midwife who, under unsterile conditions and without so much as local anesthetic, excises her xxxxoris and labia. In some places, the labia are also sewn together. This is done because of cultural belief that a woman's sexual urges are primal and out of control, and that once the possibility of a pleasurable sexual experience is removed, women are more easily controlled. You can imagine that many children die of sepsis while others live with that trauma for the rest of their lives. They are told, also, that the ritual of excision makes them more "beautiful" and "clean".

Fear of women's sexuality is a common feature among almost all patriarchal cultures, and each culture has its way of imposing control, be it psychological, spatial, or physical.

The truth is, however, that left to their own device, women want to be monogamous and want to raise a few quality children with a loving partner. Also, at one point, most women become focused on their children and have a great decrease in libido such that even having sex with their monogamous partner begins to feel like a chore, and their husbands have to put in more effort to secure regular sexual contact. This has all been studied and documented among large groups of people all over the world.

It seems to me, however, that some of our compatriots are so accustomed to seeing women as objects or as trophies or as something that they are entitled to, that they haven't taken the time to really understand and get to know what women are like. Shame on their fathers for not teaching them the truth!

[Sip]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

More anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda. ... I guess be in favour of having the woman be able sell herself to every other man that gives her some coins?

This thread has many issues going on at once. Please don't make it complicated by having such fantasy arguments. Prostitution and legalizing it is a big big big other topic and there is a big difference in "being in favor of being able to" and "being in favor of" .... VERY VERY big difference! I don't think anyone here has been advocating prostitution which what you make it sound like by your guesses. You make it sound like women's right advocates prostitution and immorality and of course you are very wrong. As much as you want to think otherwise, women can make moral choices on their own.

[Mos]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

This thread has many issues going on at once. Please don't make it complicated by having such fantasy arguments. Prostitution and legalizing it is a big big big other topic and there is a big difference in "being in favor of being able to" and "being in favor of" .... VERY VERY big difference! I don't think anyone here has been advocating prostitution which what you make it sound like by your guesses. You make it sound like women's right advocates prostitution and immorality and of course you are very wrong. As much as you want to think otherwise, women can make moral choices on their own.

Yes but sleeping with every other man (which is what happens when women enter this "sexual revolution" and reject marriage/family entity) is pretty much equivalent to prostitution. Now don't get me wrong, every society will have its whor*s and every society needs a small amount of wh*res, but surely it becoming the norm is very unacceptable.

You seem to be suggesting that a woman, any woman, who isn't placed under a man's control and surveillance would immediately and easily start sleeping with random men and accepting money for it. That's a very paranoid and skewed world view to live by. Some African cultures (Sudan, Mali, Senegal, and others) believe this also, and that is why little girls as young as 3 years old are taken to the local midwife who, under unsterile conditions and without so much as local anesthetic, excises her xxxxoris and labia. In some places, the labia are also sewn together. This is done because of cultural belief that a woman's sexual urges are primal and out of control, and that once the possibility of a pleasurable sexual experience is removed, women are more easily controlled. You can imagine that many children die of sepsis while others live with that trauma for the rest of their lives. They are told, also, that the ritual of excision makes them more "beautiful" and "clean".

Fear of women's sexuality is a common feature among almost all patriarchal cultures, and each culture has its way of imposing control, be it psychological, spatial, or physical.

The truth is, however, that left to their own device, women want to be monogamous and want to raise a few quality children with a loving partner. Also, at one point, most women become focused on their children and have a great decrease in libido such that even having sex with their monogamous partner begins to feel like a chore, and their husbands have to put in more effort to secure regular sexual contact. This has all been studied and documented among large groups of people all over the world.

It seems to me, however, that some of our compatriots are so accustomed to seeing women as objects or as trophies or as something that they are entitled to, that they haven't taken the time to really understand and get to know what women are like. Shame on their fathers for not teaching them the truth!

A women sleeping around with every man has much different implications than a man sleeping with many women. Biologically there are different implications in this. The sexual revolution/ultra-left liberal culture advocates women to flee the family constraints and allows them to sleep liberally with partners they meet, even for a day. In my book, this is more or less like prostitution, just in a more mild form. Family values and the family structure help prevent this. They can prevent the reputation of a nation's women to go down the drain.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Yes but sleeping with every other man (which is what happens when women enter this "sexual revolution" and reject marriage/family entity) is pretty much equivalent to prostitution. Now don't get me wrong, every society will have its whor*s and every society needs a small amount of wh*res, but surely it becoming the norm is very unacceptable.



A women sleeping around with every man has much different implications than a man sleeping with many women. Biologically there are different implications in this. The sexual revolution/ultra-left liberal culture advocates women to flee the family constraints and allows them to sleep liberally with partners they meet, even for a day. In my book, this is more or less like prostitution, just in a more mild form. Family values and the family structure help prevent this. They can prevent the reputation of a nation's women to go down the drain.

Wow. Just wow. I have never known anyone who is so stuck in backward ideologies as you. You have not understood or not wanted to understand anything that anyone has written to counter your very narrow views on women, sex, family structure, etc. I've known folks who think like you. They are usually young people with very strong paternal control who haven't been given the opportunity to think about whether dad's ideas work for them. For these kids, going out into the world is like getting dunked in a pool of ice water. Hopefully you will get dunked before you ruin anyone else's life.

[Sip]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Yes but sleeping with every other man (which is what happens when women enter this "sexual revolution" and reject marriage/family entity) is pretty much equivalent to prostitution.

Perhaps that was true in the 60s in the US with the sexual freedom, drugs, and the hippie movement. But after the AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases scares of the 80's and 90s, I don't think this "sexual revolution" is as much a revolution as you think. There is a big difference between 4 of 5 sexual partners in one's lifetime (they may well be very monogamous relationships) and complete promiscuity with 10s to perhaps 100's of partners through the years.

I will be VERY surprised if anyone here would advocate for the latter. The focus on the part of "sexual revolution" we are talking about here is a woman that may have a couple of different boyfriends over a period of maybe 4-5 years through college and then marrying someone after that. That's probably the extend of "sexual freedom" most of us "degenerates" are advocating here. So again, please lets not go overboard with the "women who are let loose will be whores" thinking

[Mos]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Wow. Just wow. I have never known anyone who is so stuck in backward ideologies as you. You have not understood or not wanted to understand anything that anyone has written to counter your very narrow views on women, sex, family structure, etc. I've known folks who think like you. They are usually young people with very strong paternal control who haven't been given the opportunity to think about whether dad's ideas work for them. For these kids, going out into the world is like getting dunked in a pool of ice water. Hopefully you will get dunked before you ruin anyone else's life.

So what you label a woman that sleeps with every other man? That will get in someone's bed only have a drink and small talk?? Maybe just your standards are very low.

As for your personal insults or your attempts to psychoanalyse me, please keep that to yourself. I'm not here to start a personal flame war with anybody. I have certain views and I'm ready to defend and discuss them.

[Sip]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Wow. Just wow. I have never known anyone who is so stuck in backward ideologies as you.

No need to get frustrated These kind of discussions are normally the norm. The essense of the problem is what you said many pages ago which is basically this black/white binary view of the world: A woman is either a tight inexperienced virgin or a complete loose public subway ride or someone is either a Christian moral patriot or a degenerate waste of time and space ... once these walls of absolute and extremist ways of thinking are torn down, in the end the discussion boils down to how the things have been vs how the things should be.

... and generally the way things have been were good and dandy for 1000 years ago but aren't realistic in the new age where just the fact that we are sitting around talking as a group was absolutely unimaginable to those who came up with the way things have been!

[Mos]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Perhaps that was true in the 60s in the US with the sexual freedom, drugs, and the hippie movement. But after the AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases scares of the 80's and 90s, I don't think this "sexual revolution" is as much a revolution as you think. There is a big difference between 4 of 5 sexual partners in one's lifetime (they may well be very monogamous relationships) and complete promiscuity with 10s to perhaps 100's of partners through the years.

I will be VERY surprised if anyone here would advocate for the latter. The focus on the part of "sexual revolution" we are talking about here is a woman that may have a couple of different boyfriends over a period of maybe 4-5 years through college and then marrying someone after that. That's probably the extend of "sexual freedom" most of us "degenerates" are advocating here. So again, please lets not go overboard with the "women who are let loose will be whores" thinking

What I'm saying is that yes while you will have the women who maybe have 5 sexual partners before marriage, you will also naturally have the women that had 20 or 100 and so forth. The fact that women (that deem themselves as normal) will get in bed with a man without any marital relationship is beyond me, even sometimes after just some drinks and small talk they will get in bed. A marital relationship is a prerequisite for sex for women that deem themselves as respectable. That's just my view. You can have a "boyfriend" with whom you converse and get to know for possible marriage, but beyond that I believe is crossing the line. I think sexual relations enters a whole different realm for which you need a much higher type of relationship.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

And even if a woman has had relations with partners in the double and triple digits, it is her business and her problem. Sure, a woman who is moving from one partner to the next probably has some deeper psychological issues, but that isn't every woman. And even she has the right to change her life. I am someone who's had double digit partners, and lots of them. And here I am today, happily married with two wonderful children and a husband for whom I would give my life, and moreover, I have absolutely no interest in sleeping with anyone else. I have absolutely no curiosity about what it might be like with other partners. Proof positive that having double digit sexual partners over the course of about 20 years is pretty normal. That's about the same number of partners age-matched men have over the course of a similar number of years. Why the double standard?