Armenian lesbians/gays

[retro]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Yah lets forget all the intellectual, moral, scientific, and spiritual progress humanity has made in the last 2000 years and lets go back to the dark ages. Let's believe Noah landed on our amazing mountain and Noah and the animals ran down multiplied and made our motherland what it is today. Lets pretend the fantasy father created Earth 5000 years ago and he doesn't want the woman to put the seed of the apple in her mouth and swallow for a change. She just has to look at it and wait ...

Outlaw contraception in the name of God so you scare even married people from having sex ... they can't masturbate, they can't have sex ... so what do you end up with? Taliban anyone? Where is the giant barf smilie when you need it?

Armenians should not turn their back on traditional Christian beliefs and values their is nothing "progressive" about degenerates. Who erroneously believe in a life of freedom without responsibility.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Armenians should not turn their back on traditional Christian beliefs and values their is nothing "progressive" about degenerates. Who erroneously believe in a life of freedom without responsibility.

So, anyone who is a free-thinker or diverges from any aspect of what is traditionally Armenian (as perceived by you) is immoral and irresponsible? I see the opposite happening. Religion extracts responsibility from the individual whereas free thought correlates with an internal locus of control based in empathy and respect for the rights of others.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Private land owners in Armenia need to be forced to lease large tracks of arable land to agricultural businesses or be subject to massive fines.

Ya, good luck with that...

Also, regarding the nuclear family? Not sure what you mean exactly when you say "nuclear family", but having studied the anthropology of kinship (it was all anyone ever talked about in the 80's), my understanding is that the nuclear family is a modern phenomenon, mostly adopted by post-industrial societies. Armenians have rarely operated on the system of mother, father, 2-5 children under one roof. That's the Western model that you seem to despise and denigrate. Armenians have lived in multigenerational extended family systems for a very long time, as have other agricultural-pastoral societies and continue to do so. So, the Kibbutz idea could easily be implemented and would encourage sharing of resources among many families rather than a competition between neighboring clans.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Yah lets forget all the intellectual, moral, scientific, and spiritual progress humanity has made in the last 2000 years and lets go back to the dark ages. Let's believe Noah landed on our amazing mountain and Noah and the animals ran down multiplied and made our motherland what it is today. Lets pretend the fantasy father created Earth 5000 years ago and he doesn't want the woman to put the seed of the apple in her mouth and swallow for a change. She just has to look at it and wait ...

Outlaw contraception in the name of God so you scare even married people from having sex ... they can't masturbate, they can't have sex ... so what do you end up with? Taliban anyone? Where is the giant barf smilie when you need it?

What is clear is that when restrictions are placed on things connected to people's basic biological needs and functions, someone stands to profit.

Wherever abortions are banned, people find ways to get them either by going to the state next door, or by going to an underground practitioner and paying loads of cash which then has to be laundered.

You mention masturbation. That's an interesting one. No doubt you have heard about "hysteria"? Well, as it turns out the "condition" has been around for as long as the medical profession has been, and was only pulled from the diagnostic manuals recently. So, the idea was that the uterus would start choking a woman from the inside, and the only way to treat this was to go to a doctor who would manually bring her to orgasm, and lo and behold, the symptoms would recede, but would eventually resurface, and the woman would present for treatment again.

So, why were women hysterical to begin with, you may ask? Well, at that time, sex was not understood as something that should give a woman pleasure and gratification, and some women had inept partners who were of the "wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am" mindset. Also, masturbation was considered a sin, something that would lead to blindness and all sorts of other ills. So, you had all these sexually frustrated women who couldn't get off because vaginal sex doesn't always give results, and who weren't allowed to masturbate. So, they went to the doctor and paid him to do it.

(Isn't it interesting? When a woman sells sexual satisfaction, she is a xxxxx. When a man does it, he is a doctor.)

Anyhow, to continue, the great majority of women diagnosed as "hysterical" were women who were unmarried (they were labeled "spinsters" after the age of 23), widows, nuns, certainly some lesbians, etc...

So, some men, aka doctors, got to profit from the restriction of normal, mutually-satisfying, non-procreative sex. But, as it turned out, the process became tedious and time-consuming. So, a really smart person invented a machine just for the purpose of reducing hysterical symptoms: the original vibrator. Yes, ladies and gentlemen. The vibrator was invented as a tool for physicians providing treatment for hysteria. Now, it didn't take as long, and they could provide the service for more paying consumers. Also, they didn't have to deal with the yucky aspects of the manual method.

This is just one illustration of what happens when people can't freely access those things that are implicit and inherent to the survival of the species. Men go to prostitutes (who are other peoples sisters). Women go to "doctors". The money trail goes underground and funds a network of illicit profit, money laundering, corruption...

The examples are many. The opium poppy fields in Afghanistan are another. People find it more profitable to grow opium poppies than food. But look what happens then. You should see the series "Traffik".

[Siggie]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

There are people living in tin containers like this in Armenia... How about we improve living conditions first before we talk about needing to increase the population by banning birth control and abortions.

[Siggie]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

and yeah, there are women's right issues in Armenia that have people (not just women) upset...

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

...and some people think abortion and contraception should be banned, withheld, whatever... and that the population should be increased despite the fact that even one member of the existing population lives like this.

It all trails back around to the notion of making Armenia a country that a young person (male or female, gay, straight, bi, trans, whatever...) feels they can live happy fulfilling lives where their freedoms are not under constant threat.

[Mos]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

More anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda. I guess they would be advocating that a man lose all his authority in the household? I guess be in favour of having the woman be able sell herself to every other man that gives her some coins?

As to the poverty, yes some people do live like that, it's unfortunate reality that should be addressed (and is slowly being done so), but in every country/society you have such desolate poverty, especially in post-Soviet countries.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

More anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda. I guess they would be advocating that a man lose all his authority in the household? I guess be in favour of having the woman be able sell herself to every other man that gives her some coins?

As to the poverty, yes some people do live like that, it's unfortunate reality that should be addressed (and is slowly being done so), but in every country/society you have such desolate poverty, especially in post-Soviet countries.

Can you tell me which part of it is not true? The part that there is a real problem regarding violence against women? Or the fact that the authorities aren't taking it serious because it has become a part of our culture? How is it anti-Armenian? I don't see anywhere anything anti-Armenian on it.
Violence against women is a real problem, not because of the violence it self, because that happens in any culture and country. Everywhere you have weaklings who are not strong enough for the outside world take out their anger against their wife and children. But the fact that so many people, women and men regard it as something normal. Mostly it is the uneducated part of society who regards it as normal from my own experience.
I can tell you some of the stories that I heard about incidents of beatings that will make you go sick.

So the bottom line is that there is a real problem in Armenia today and we cannot put our head in the sand and yell anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda and be done with it.

[Mos]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Can you tell me which part of it is not true? The part that there is a real problem regarding violence against women? Or the fact that the authorities aren't taking it serious because it has become a part of our culture? How is it anti-Armenian? I don't see anywhere anything anti-Armenian on it.
Violence against women is a real problem, not because of the violence it self, because that happens in any culture and country. Everywhere you have weaklings who are not strong enough for the outside world take out their anger against their wife and children. But the fact that so many people, women and men regard it as something normal. Mostly it is the uneducated part of society who regards it as normal from my own experience.
I can tell you some of the stories that I heard about incidents of beatings that will make you go sick.

So the bottom line is that there is a real problem in Armenia today and we cannot put our head in the sand and yell anti-Armenian/feminist propaganda and be done with it.

Obviously if a woman or any person for that matter is beat up for no reason, then the necessary laws apply. That being said, if a woman begins flirting with other men, if she becomes promiscuous, or out-right disrespectful, violence against such women becomes natural and often justified. I don't like though when outside people begin prying into other families' business and marital relations. All that should stay within the family and be a private matter. Often such feminists begin with such propaganda in order to push their agenda which includes breaking the culture that woman should become wives/mothers.