Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

This time you guys deserve it....






And WHO desides it YOU....?/??

You call yourself patriot insulting others?
Shut your dirty mouth man.
Stop using this WMD issue to insult oters. It is not only WMD but many many other weapons too. And people that are going to die from it are mainly eatern armenians, not you guys. So stop pretending to be more catolic than the pope OK? If you care about it so much than you should be living in Stepanakert and then maybe you would know if anybody complained or lifted their finger or protested or what's goin on there. Or maybe you can teach russian-Armenians how to protest or do whatever needs to be done.


Can you put one and one together? on one hand you are insulting russian Armenians, and on the other saying that we are one?

OK, if you think that me asking why there has not been a response from the all powerful Armenian lobby in Russia against this extraordinary weapons transfer is an insult then you really are missing on your medication.

Again, we all know Russia sells arms o Azerbaijan and we have no problem...we Armenians like to know why you proud Russian Armenians did not at least raise a concern about this? is it because you are are making money off of it or is it Armenian lives mean nothing to you wannabe Russians.

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

[QUOTE=Eddo211;343602]

OK, if you think that me asking why there has not been a response from the all powerful Armenian lobby in Russia against this extraordinary weapons transfer is an insult then you really are missing on your medication.

Again, we all know Russia sells arms o Azerbaijan and we have no problem...we Armenians like to know why you proud Russian Armenians did not at least raise a concern about this? is it because you are are making money off of it or is it Armenian lives mean nothing to you wannabe Russians.

Man.... you keep insulting me personally right and left. Eddo, today I saw not a balansed and informed member here, but an angry kid who for some reason has something personal against me regardless of topics and does not stop throwing punches under belt. I am not ging to let this discussion slide, so god please give me patience. What medicine am I taking in your opinion? Or whose life I don't care about?
Listen man.
Number one... There is no Armenian or any other ethnic lobby in russia. Never has and never will as like in USA. There is no legislative body or any institution to lobby in. Everithyng is decided and done very diffrently there than in US. As a matter of fact, no minority or group can organise politically and not invite the ire of russian security organisations and actually make more damage then something positive. There has not been and will probably never be "democracy" there like in US. So everything is being decided behind the curtains and closed doors in a very diffrent way. That is not to say, however, that you can not organise as a nation.
You as a nationality can organise under cultural banner and then quitely, behind the curtain do your thing. that is how it has been and how it will be. That is how russia is. Not our choice.
Throughout history russian Armenian diaspora has been the most powerfull, building national structures in eastern Armenia. Greatly affecting russian policies in region. But after bolshevic revolution in 1917 all stractures like this were destroyed. Any form of any national manifestation was brutally suppressed. So it is only just 20-23 years or less, that diasporan organisations in russia or other republics like ukraine, are being rebuilt and strengthened. You cannot compare a 20 year old structure with a 90 yr old, can you? Especially if they are not going to look and operate like one another. But russian Armenian diaspora is getting active quickly. The proof is in the millions of dollars collected in Armenia telethone in past 3 years. Actually money wise by donations russia diaspora is second to US, and with general money transwers to back home No1 in rank.
Now about weapons sold to azerbaijan. I can guarantee you that whatever is being done you cannot see all, so don't judge something that you will never know about fully. I am not pretending that I know exactly what. But I know how the system works there. All those years all the weapons transfers to us or our enemies have gone under the hottest political maneuvres that you and me will not know.
So it is very unjust to throw insults to anybody without full knowledge. Stop that before talking about unity.
If you have any ideas as to how russian Armenians should have responded about weapons, you should put down point by point and show why you think the way you are. That will be patriotic for sure.

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Man.... you keep insulting me personally right and left. Eddo, today I saw not a balansed and informed member here, but an angry kid who for some reason has something personal against me regardless of topics and does not stop throwing punches under belt. I am not ging to let this discussion slide, so god please give me patience. What medicine am I taking in your opinion? Or whose life I don't care about?
Listen man.
Number one... There is no Armenian or any other ethnic lobby in russia. Never has and never will as like in USA. There is no legislative body or any institution to lobby in. Everithyng is decided and done very diffrently there than in US. As a matter of fact, no minority or group can organise politically and not invite the ire of russian security organisations and actually make more damage then something positive. There has not been and will probably never be "democracy" there like in US. So everything is being decided behind the curtains and closed doors in a very diffrent way. That is not to say, however, that you can not organise as a nation.
You as a nationality can organise under cultural banner and then quitely, behind the curtain do your thing. that is how it has been and how it will be. That is how russia is. Not our choice.
Throughout history russian Armenian diaspora has been the most powerfull, building national structures in eastern Armenia. Greatly affecting russian policies in region. But after bolshevic revolution in 1917 all stractures like this were destroyed. Any form of any national manifestation was brutally suppressed. So it is only just 20-23 years or less, that diasporan organisations in russia or other republics like ukraine, are being rebuilt and strengthened. You cannot compare a 20 year old structure with a 90 yr old, can you? Especially if they are not going to look and operate like one another. But russian Armenian diaspora is getting active quickly. The proof is in the millions of dollars collected in Armenia telethone in past 3 years. Actually money wise by donations russia diaspora is second to US, and with general money transwers to back home No1 in rank.
Now about weapons sold to azerbaijan. I can guarantee you that whatever is being done you cannot see all, so don't judge something that you will never know about fully. I am not pretending that I know exactly what. But I know how the system works there. All those years all the weapons transfers to us or our enemies have gone under the hottest political maneuvres that you and me will not know.
So it is very unjust to throw insults to anybody without full knowledge. Stop that before talking about unity.
If you have any ideas as to how russian Armenians should have responded about weapons, you should put down point by point and show why you think the way you are. That will be patriotic for sure.

Any unity between us you made it very clear on your post after I asked you.....nice cop out btw. Your bed time story doesn't fool adults and you know very well Armenians in Russia have alot more pull than you like to describe it.
Regardless the attitude is what is wrong, you yourself are not one bit worried about and see no reason for Armenians to be angry about it because you believe that your Russia will save us all.

OK lets say you are right, when it comes to arming the enemy Russian Armenians are powerless to last degree.....why did Russia do this WMD arms transfer? new regional policy?

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Read post #374 on page 25.

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Typical weak response....don't have anything to say then just STFU comrade.

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Typical weak response....don't have anything to say then just STFU comrade.

Why is it "typical" weak responce? can you explain?
Are you sayng STFU to yourself?

How old are you EDDO?

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Common then tell me why instead saying read my old post....tell me why Russia is doing this for its own interests and the logic behind selling Smerch to Azerbaijan and then giving us a counter and how much better off we are.

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Common then tell me why instead saying read my old post....tell me why Russia is doing this for its own interests and the logic behind selling Smerch to Azerbaijan and then giving us a counter and how much better off we are.

To keep both Armenia and azerbaijan dependent for arms and security from russia. To maintain russian controll of not only Armenia but also azerbaijan. To keep turkey, US, Israel out of area and lessen the possibility of baku-Nato coaperation as much as possible.
We are not better off, nor we are on the brink of security collapse. Basically nothing changes militariliy. If azerbaijan bought this armament from turkey or anybody else (and it would no mater what. they got billions to spend), then russia had to counter with much much bigger and massive arms transwer to Yerevan. Baku knows this and would not want it to happen. Buying it from russia, azrbaijan restores Moscow-Baku relations a bit, that got so saur after gabala.
On the other hand this was a sweet $1bln deal on the russian point. I have told long time ago that economically russia plays supply and counter game. Give a litte to Armenia and azebaijan buys even more with money.
But, I don't see any signs that russia wants us to loose karabakh conflict or anything against baku. Even at the times of "Koltso" (Ring) operation russia did not want Armenians to loose the war with baku. For russia knows this for 200 years that if Armenia dissapears so will the foothold there and like dominoe efect all the area up to northern caucasus will fall out of russias controll and threaten security of Stavropol and Krasnodar and whole that southern flank of russia (Russia's breadbasket). Those were the areas ander ottoman empire. That empire's descendents or other powers are still trying to take it's place. The proof of this for russia is the fall of Georgia under turkish/Nato controll, foreign participation in chechnia wars, instability in Dagestan, Azerbaijan/turkey unity. This bothers russia a great deal.

[Eddo211]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

To keep both Armenia and azerbaijan dependent for arms and security from russia. To maintain russian controll of not only Armenia but also azerbaijan. To keep turkey, US, Israel out of area and lessen the possibility of baku-Nato coaperation as much as possible.
We are not better off, nor we are on the brink of security collapse. Basically nothing changes militariliy. If azerbaijan bought this armament from turkey or anybody else (and it would no mater what. they got billions to spend), then russia had to counter with much much bigger and massive arms transwer to Yerevan. Baku knows this and would not want it to happen. Buying it from russia, azrbaijan restores Moscow-Baku relations a bit, that got so saur after gabala.
On the other hand this was a sweet $1bln deal on the russian point. I have told long time ago that economically russia plays supply and counter game. Give a litte to Armenia and azebaijan buys even more with money.
But, I don't see any signs that russia wants us to loose karabakh conflict or anything against baku. Even at the times of "Koltso" (Ring) operation russia did not want Armenians to loose the war with baku. For russia knows this for 200 years that if Armenia dissapears so will the foothold there and like dominoe efect all the area up to northern caucasus will fall out of russias controll and threaten security of Stavropol and Krasnodar and whole that southern flank of russia (Russia's breadbasket). Those were the areas ander ottoman empire. That empire's descendents or other powers are still trying to take it's place. The proof of this for russia is the fall of Georgia under turkish/Nato controll, foreign participation in chechnia wars, instability in Dagestan, Azerbaijan/turkey unity. This bothers russia a great deal.

+1....

[Haykakan]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

It is refreshing to see your posts Hakob. Most posts here are far from reason and are based more on ignorance or hate. Eddo is a good guy but he like many others here thinks that the whole world works like the USA but this is not true and this is a good thing. The entire USA government is bought, paid for, and administered by special interest groups and our enemies have far greater resources here then we will ever have thus the USA is a loosing battle for us Armenians. Russia is very different-special interest in Russia has a very limited role and this is a good thing firstly for Russia and secondly for us because our enemies who are far richer then us cannot get as much sway there as they can here. It is not in Russia's interest to have a powerful independent Armenia nor a powerful and independent Azerbadjan. It is in Russia's interest to keep them both dependent. A lot of people here are seeing the world via western media (even in Armenia) and this is a huge mistake and a gross misrepresentation of reality. The simple and indisputable fact which is the only one that really matters is that wo Russia there is no Armenia no matter how colorful your imagination is. This fact may change in time with other powers like China and Iran rising but as for now as it has been for a long time Russia is the only answer to Armenia's survival. This does not mean we should not try to better ourselves and our country in every way possible but the basic facts should never be ignored.