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Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

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  • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

    Originally posted by londontsi View Post
    As far as I know the Azeri have a communication satellite.
    It is geostationary some 20.000 miles high and basically used for communications.

    Turkey on the other hand has a surveillance (low orbit) satellite with high resolution.
    One has to assume that data would pass to the Azeri specially during a war.

    Are we suggesting attacking the Turkish satellite.
    Azeries are planning to have surveillance satellite, like Turkey; you mentioned.


    And their first communication satellite will ensure $10 million income in 2013.
    Last edited by gegev; 08-26-2013, 11:21 PM.

    Comment


    • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

      I see things in this list that just do not make any sense. Like you say that Russian satellite info will be unreliable yet you suggest using French satellite info instead-so what makes you think that the French info is more reliable than the Russian?
      Hayastan or Bust.

      Comment


      • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

        Originally posted by gegev View Post
        When the war starts; (updated version)

        What are Azeri advantages?
        1) They will rely on a surprise and a diversionary attack. (Londontsi)
        2) Smerch will be very effective, as a mass destruction weapon in plain/flat land with high concentration of troops w/o proper entrenchment and underground fortifications as well as weaponry located in open air.
        3) They have proper arsenal of other sophisticated weapons.
        4) Guarantee that Russian’s wouldn’t intervene and hoping that Artsakh/Armenia will loose time and efforts on asking Russian’s to intervene and will be anxious by getting refusal or promise to intervene later on. What guarantee ? Do you have a link?
        5) Hoping that Artsakh/Armenia leaders wouldn’t be that decisive, to react immediately, and will try to stop it by applying to the international community, loosing precious time to react.
        6) Knowing our troop/weaponry locations that are not changed/dispositioned for years.
        7) Enjoying Turkish and “Turkic” concealed support in manpower, armament and political area.
        8) They have their own satellite to screen/locate objects in Artsakh/Armenia. Are they fully aware of its know how; to use properly?
        9) Artsakh army wouldn't target Azeri civilians.
        ...
        What are our advantages?
        1) We hold the higher ground (in general) and normally it is easier to defend than to take. (Eddo)
        2) Artsakh/Armenian soldiers are better trained and have a stronger will. (Eddo)
        3) Counter attack is inbuilt as part of the defence strategy. (Londontsi)
        ...
        What are Azeri weaknesses?
        1) They can attack only Artsakh, while Artsakh will target all the country. That's not necessarily true
        2) Oil, gas fields and major industrial complexes can be destroyed during the first hours of war. Excluding the oil fields in the Caspian that can cause environmental disaster of the sea. (Hakob)
        3) Lack of strong will. (Eddo)
        4) Lack of proper training. (Eddo)
        5) The battlefield hostilities will quickly evolve into artillery duels. (Londontsi)
        6) If the Azeri are seen to have started the war they will loose all political support from US, France and other EU countries. (Londontsi)
        7) Turkish involvement has to be discounted. (Londontsi) What about Iran ? Maybe they would get involved? Politically or militarily
        8) Although we will suffer, the level of refugees and destruction would be much higher on the Azeri side. (Londontsi)
        9) Azeri may suffer internal ethnic unrest or rebellion against aliev's clan in case of prolonged hostilities. (Hakob)

        10) Azeries are world wide known as an oppressor of its population democratic rights. That doesn't mean xxxx in the real world though

        11) Fresh memories on crashing defeat in recent Artsakh war.


        What are our weaknesses?
        1) Low military budget. (Eddo)
        2) Small airforce. (Eddo)
        3) Latest and on-going arming of Azerbaijan. (Londontsi)
        4) Azeries will target our civil population.
        5) With artillery engagements, close proximity trenches will become impossible to hold. (Londontsi)

        What should be done before the war starts?
        1) With good intelligence, if we know an attack is imminent, we should pre-empt and deny them the surprise. (Eddo)
        2) Building additional entrenchments and underground fortifications in the plain/flat land areas.
        3) I heard we have arrangements with France to use their satellite data for screening/locating military/other objects in Azerbaijan, because the Russian data will be unreliable.
        4) The times require us to grow up and make/produce our own satellite and/or their parts/subsystems. (Londontsi)
        5) Azeri positions will become vulnerable with the tactical evacuation of Armenian trenches.(Londontsi)
        5) Mobilizing military specialists of Armenian decent, from Russia, that are familiar with “Smerch” and other weapon know-how; that Azeries bought from Russia. Scientists that took part in developing the arms will be very useful.
        6) Intensifying our UAV production and thinking about their other alternative usage ways. (censoring, bombing, transportation of things, ... (Hakob)
        7) Laser military technology further development and its possible usage against enemy satellites. (Hakob)

        ...
        Gegev, I've put mine in Blue italicized bold for you to amend your original

        Comment


        • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

          When the war starts;

          What are Azeri advantages?
          ...

          4) Guarantee that Russian’s wouldn’t intervene and hoping that Artsakh/Armenia will loose time and efforts on asking Russian’s to intervene and will be anxious by getting refusal or promise to intervene later on. What guarantee ? Do you have a link?

          What are Azeri weaknesses?
          1) They can attack only Artsakh, while Artsakh will target all the country. That's not necessarily true
          ...

          7) Turkish involvement has to be discounted. (Londontsi) What about Iran ? Maybe they would get involved? Politically or militarily
          ...
          10) Azeries are world wide known as an oppressor of its population democratic rights. That doesn't mean xxxx in the real world though.
          Hrai I guess your comments don't fit with the points much.

          Point #4
          My only link is the developments we have seen up to date and the common logic. Russia didn't ever confirm that it will intervene in case of Areri attack on Artsakh. Do you have a link for the opposite? Azeries wouldn't start the war, if they beforehand wouldn't be assured/guaranteed by Russians, that will not intervene. That is; they will start it only after getting Russia's approval.

          Point #1
          The statement; "that's not necessarily true" is about the same as...
          "that's not necessarily false".

          Point #7
          "Maybe they would get involved?"
          How can one discuss something started with "maybe"?

          Point #10
          It is a weaknesses, because the oppressed population, in case of war, wouldn't carry out the oppressor's commands properly.
          Last edited by gegev; 08-29-2013, 12:37 AM.

          Comment


          • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

            Originally posted by gegev View Post
            Hrai I guess your comments don't fit with the points much.

            Point #4
            My only link is the developments we have seen up to date and the common logic. Russia didn't ever confirm that it will intervene in case of Areri attack on Artsakh. Do you have a link for the opposite? Azeries wouldn't start the war, if they beforehand wouldn't be assured/guaranteed by Russians, that will not intervene. That is; they will start it only after getting Russia's approval.
            I think if the baboons decide to start anything they'll start without asking anyone. They will be a point where their armaments reach a critical mass whereupon they will then use them. Pretty much like the US military is now looking to expend some weaponry on Syria after they've restocked from Libya, the manufacturers have been pushing the Pentagon.....stockpiles don't keep the factories running you know.
            Point #1
            The statement; "that's not necessarily true" is about the same as...
            "that's not necessarily false".
            I agree with you therefore the entire point is redundant and should be considered for deletion.
            Point #7
            "Maybe they would get involved?"
            How can one discuss something started with "maybe"?
            Iran is fast running out of any friendly faces, look at Syria, they would not contemplate baboon aggression against Artsakh which if successful would close the border with Armenia and logically step up baboonish agitation in the real azerbaijan.
            Point #10
            It is a weaknesses, because the oppressed population, in case of war, wouldn't carry out the oppressor's commands properly.
            Oh really ? I think the history of the 20th Century would tell us something different.
            Last edited by hrai; 08-29-2013, 02:49 AM. Reason: insert

            Comment


            • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

              Պուտինի ու Էրդողանի վերջին ակտը հայերի հաշվին
              Նաիրա Հայրումյան
              Ուրբաթ, 30 Օգոստոսի 2013,


              Ռուսական կայսրությունը նման է տապալված ցուլի, որի վրա «դանակավորները շատացել են»: Մոսկվան ստիպված է աշխատել միանգամից մի քանի տասնյակ ճակատով: Եւ օրեցօր խնդիրներն ավելանում են՝ երբ հյուսվածքը մաշված է, չես հասցնում կարկատել:
              Արեւմտյան մամուլում պարբերաբար հոդվածներ են հայտնվում, որոնցում մեկ հռչակվում է Ռուսաստանի վերջը, մեկ նշվում, թե «մահվան մասին խոսակցությունները ժամանակավրեպ են»: Սակայն դրանք նույն գործընթացի երկու ծայրահեղությունն են՝ ռուսական կայսրությունն իսկապես փլուզվում է, սակայն Ռուսաստանը ստանում է ամրապնդվելու եւ հզոր պետություն դառնալու հնարավորություն:
              Պուտինյան Ռուսաստանն ինքզինքը պատկերացնում է բացառապես կայսերական տարածությունում, սակայն դրա համար չեն բավարարում ոչ ուժը, ոչ փողը, ոչ էլ գաղափարախոսությունը: Ազատական եւ այլ ուժերը վաղուց կոչ են անում հրաժարվել կայսերական հավակնություններից եւ ստեղծել ուժեղ ու հարմարավետ պետություն Ռուսաստանի ներկայիս սահմաններում:
              Ուկրաինայի ամենա«պրոռուսական» նախագահը՝ Յանուկովիչը, այսօր հայտարարել է, որ ոչինչ չի կարող խանգարել Ուկրաինայի եւ Եվրամիության միջեւ Ասոցացման համաձայնագրի ստորագրմանը: Նա հիշեցրել է, որ Ուկրաինայի եվրոպական ընտրությունն ամրագրված է Ներքին ու արտաքին քաղաքականության հիմքերի մասին օրենքով եւ ենթակա չէ կասկածի:
              Մինսկի բանտում արդեն մեկ շաբաթ նստած է Ուրալկալիում ընկերության տնօրենը, ով նույնպես դարձել է Ռուսաստանի կայսերական հավակնությունների զոհը: Ի պատասխան ձերբակալության, Ռուսաստանը կրճատել է նավթի մատակարարումը Բելառուս եւ արգելել այդ երկրից խոզի մսի ներմուծումը: Դրանից հետո Բուլղարիայում Բելառուսի դեսպանը խոսել է այդ երկրի ԱԳ նախարարի հետ Արեւելյան գործընկերության վերաբերյալ բանակցությունը վերսկսելու հարցով:
              Ռուսաստանը փորձում է կայսերական հավակնություններն իրականացնել գոնե «չճանաչված» պետություններում, օրինակ՝ կառուցում է Սուվորովյան ուսումնարաններ, հող նախապատրաստելով ճանաչման եւ ռազմական ներկայության համար: Սակայն այս գաղափարն էլ, երեւում է, չի ընկալվում, համենայնդեպս Հայաստանում:
              Կայսերական հավակնությունները չար կատակ են խաղացել նաեւ Թուրքիայի հետ, որը նույնպես հայտնվել է փլուզման եզրին: Թուրքական Ջումհուրիյեթ թերթը կանխատեսել է Էրդողանի քաղաքականության վերջը, գրելով, թե նեոօսմանյան հավակնությունների պատճառով երկիրը հայտնվել է մասնատման առջեւ:
              Ներկայիս Ռուսական կայսրությունն ու Թուրքիան կառուցված են նույն սկզբունքներով, եւ պատահական չէ, որ նրանք եւ նախկինում, եւ ներկայում օգնում են միմյանց գոյատեւել: Հաճախ դա տեղի է ունեցել հայերի հաշվին, որոնց Ռուսաստանը վախեցրել է Թուրքիայով եւ առել իր «հովանու տակ»: Իսկ Թուրքիան էլ բարկացած տեսք է ընդունել, որ հայերը չկասկածեն:
              Ներկայում այս երկու կայսրությունները հայտնվել են վտանգավոր սահմանագծին, որը սակայն կարող է նաեւ լավ ցատկահարթակ դառնալ: Պատահական չէ, որ համաշխարհային մամուլում ««ում հերթն է Սիրիայից հետո» հարցին ավելի շատ նշվում են Թուրքիան ու Ռուսաստանը, քան Իրանը:
              Հայաստանը, որը ներկայում կիսված է Ռուսաստանի կայսրության ու Թուրքիայի միջեւ, պետք է պատրաստվի նոր Ռուսաստանի ու նոր Թուրքիայի հետ իրավահավասար հարաբերություններ հաստատելուն, քանի որ ներկայիս կայսրությունների փլուզումը մոտ է: Իսկ մինչ այդ, պետք է պատրաստ լինել հայերի հաշվին այս երկուսի «փոխօգնության» հերթական հնարավոր ակտին:
              - See more at: http://www.lragir.am/index/arm/0/pol....Jm3gGarw.dpuf

              Comment


              • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

                Armenia to Join Russian-led Customs Union and Eurasian Economic Union



                Armenia To Join Russia-Led Customs Union

                Armenian President Serzh Sarkisian says his country has decided to join the Russia-led Customs Union.

                Comment


                • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

                  Considering the situation Armenia is in, considering the military building of the Azeris, I think this is a move that is logical in the short term. Realistically the EU can't offer Armenia much in the next 5-10 years, especially when it comes to defense. In the long term the EU was the better choice, but unfortunately, when you have the geopolitical situation Armenia has, sometimes if you don't consider the short term, there won't be a long term.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

                    Originally posted by Mher View Post
                    Considering the situation Armenia is in, considering the military building of the Azeris, I think this is a move that is logical in the short term. Realistically the EU can't offer Armenia much in the next 5-10 years, especially when it comes to defense. In the long term the EU was the better choice, but unfortunately, when you have the geopolitical situation Armenia has, sometimes if you don't consider the short term, there won't be a long term.
                    Armenia made the right choice, economically, militarily, and geopolitically. I almost want to congratulate the Armenian people. The European Union has noting to offer us. This will serve Armenia's LONG-TERM interests. Economically, Europe is a sinking ship. Greece, Bulgaria, Italy... the list goes on. When you look back at history, it was the "Christian" Europeans that betrayed us and left us at the mercy of Turkish barbarians. It was that same "democratic and humanist" Europe that let a mentally-ill heinous barbarian butcher ax-murderer RAMIL SAFAROV go scott-free to a hero's welcome in his Nazi-like so-called "Republic of Azerbaijan." Militarily, Europe couldn't guarantee the security of it's own participants in the "Partnership for peace," let alone offer any security to the republic of Armenia. Europe is in bed with Turks and the Azeri oil company, who turn a blind eye to the undemocratic and brutal suppression of it's own people. I am not mention even mentioning turning a blind eye on the Geneva convention treatment of prisoners of war by Azerbaijan.

                    I AM SURE TURKS AND AZERIS ARE EATING THEMSELVES UP.

                    LONG-LIVE ARMENIAN-RUSSIAN STRATEGIC PARTNERSHIP, AND BROTHERHOOD!

                    Chew on that Azeri M#$^&^&*ers

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                    • Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

                      Originally posted by Mher View Post
                      Considering the situation Armenia is in, considering the military building of the Azeris, I think this is a move that is logical in the short term. Realistically the EU can't offer Armenia much in the next 5-10 years, especially when it comes to defense. In the long term the EU was the better choice, but unfortunately, when you have the geopolitical situation Armenia has, sometimes if you don't consider the short term, there won't be a long term.
                      This pretty much sums up. Thanks.
                      Only want to add few points.
                      1) Europe wil never guarantee Armenia's security with the partnership format offered (or available) to us.
                      2) Most of our economic misfortunes are because of our own corruption and laziness. Blockade is secondary. Would europe accept Armenia as a second Greece and sink money in us? I think not
                      Last edited by Hakob; 09-03-2013, 09:00 PM.

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