Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

[gegev]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Yes, that is the easy part.

Can he keep them all happy ????

Currently the last one seems to be very happy. But I have no idea about the rest.

Russia acts in its own interest and that is no reason to demonize it like many here do. Sure it arms the azeris along with a us and a hundred other nations. If Russia was not there the azeris could afford to buy weapons from the west but we could not. It does not take a genius to understand such basic things but the anti russian mob here is strong in its dilusional hatred of the only thing that keeps the Armenian nation in existence. Serj has been running the "complimentary foreign policy" much better then many believed was possible. It is rather hypocritical of you people to demand that Armenia act in its own interest while demanding Russia to act in Armenias interest as well. Russia is not our sugar daddy so do not expect it to act like one.

West doesn't sell weapons of significant impact to Azerbaijan, they follow the rules set about conflict zones. This is the main reason for buying armament from Russia, prices in west doesn't vary much from Russian ones, given the quality and Azeries have no financial restrictions/shortages. Azeries will be glad buying weapons from west and making them dependant (as it is in case of Russia) financially to insure their support in future. They would be much more satisfied to exchange Russian support by the Western one. You should search to find some other reasonable "arguments" to support Russia and blame the West and Armenians that protest against the Russian anti-Armenian actions.

All you are saying, for years, is: Armenia can't survive without Russia. Meanwhile Armenia survived for centuries regardless of Russian "ally's" oppression, but Russia never accepted that its victories in the area are achieved mostly due to Armenians/Armenia's support. So I'm sure that the Armenians support to Russia was significant for centuries, but we didn't get any rewards for that from our "talking ally", and the contrary happened all the way.

Why you don't create such a thread, to see Armenians reaction to it?

[londontsi]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

All you are saying, for years, is: Armenia can't survive without Russia. Meanwhile Armenia survived for centuries regardless of Russian "ally's" oppression, but Russia never accepted that its victories in the area are achieved mostly due to Armenia's support. So I'm sure that the Armenia's support to Russia was significant for centuries, but we didn't get any rewards for that from our "talking ally", and the contrary happened all the way.

Why you don't create such a thread, to see Armenians reaction to it?

Armenia was a victim and at the mercy of predator nations and empires who used us as well as double crossed us time and time again, Russia included.
When Russia (the growing empire) was “invited” to be our next dominating power, because we were fed up with the previous one, we did not have sovereignty having lost it God knows how many centuries before.
Internal squabbles and treacheries played their part to become what we were and what we were becoming.

History has no end. Nations and Nation States do have an end.
Vulture states surrounding us are hovering above.
If we do not see them for a few months or years we think they have gone forever.

No, they are only having a rest.
Their thinking is its not worth their energy just now but they can be up there anytime when opportunity presents itself.

Currently there are some who are looking for a new dominating Power to be under. Maybe EU or US or God knows who.

Lets take EU, dominated by Germany has shafted Greece and Spain big time and making them into vassal states.
Cyprus, not only been turned into a vassal state but the people have been robbed down to their underpants.

Some “Intellectuals” think being European is something good so they want to be one of them.
A simple analogy is if one joins a gay club it does not mean he has become a gay person if he does not live like a gay person!!!

Seriously, we forget the number of empires that originated from Europe and the way they treated their conquests.
Spain, British Empire, France, Belgium and the list goes on.
Not to forget the last attempt by Germany. Some people like to call it Nazi Germany to avoid embarrassing the present Germans.

I could go on and on.

The answer to our success as a nation and a state is not finding the next power to be the vassal of and "be looked after", but understand the need to build a healthy state from within.

[arakeretzig]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

The answer to our success as a nation and a state is not finding the next power to be the vassal of and "be looked after", but understand the need to build a healthy state from within.

Armenia should continue doing what it's doing now, play hard to get. Although i think we're too soft on the russians right now, and give them too much. We should do like Serbia ( or even Azerbaidzjan itself) does, like a beautiful woman playing hard to get, for two mobster bosses (EU and Russia).

[TomServo]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

The answer to our success as a nation and a state is not finding the next power to be the vassal of and "be looked after", but understand the need to build a healthy state from within.

True. I don't know if it's so much about understanding anymore -- most people in Armenia will surely be in agreement about wanting a healthy state to be built from within? It's the noxious oligarchy that does not.

And I'm just going to ignore that post above about mob mistresses.

[Haykakan]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Armenia should continue doing what it's doing now, play hard to get. Although i think we're too soft on the russians right now, and give them too much. We should do like Serbia ( or even Azerbaidzjan itself) does, like a beautiful woman playing hard to get, for two mobster bosses (EU and Russia).

Serbia and Azerbadjan you say? What do they both have in common? Oh yeh they lost territories..Think about it. As for the likes of Gageve who enjoys living in a delusion any MMO maker would be jealous of, you say Armenia survived for centuries without Russian ally like you mean before there was a Turkey? Like yeh sure we were kind of - sort of a power in the region thousends of years ago but that has no relevence now. Armenia has not been independent for so long that your comment is meaningless and hollow. There is no scenario in the present that has Armenia surviving wo Russia but yeh you go on and pretend that little resoursless Armenia is a superpower who can stand up to Turkey, Iran, Russia, USA, Europe, ..Most men over time understand that they are not invincible as they get older but time seems to have the opposite effect on you. londontsi finely said something i agree with " need to build a healthy state from within." yes this is exactly what we need to do and what i have been preaching all along but we have to do this under the radar because no one in the region wants a strong - independent Armenia. A strong Armenia is just another headache for the powers of the day to deal with so we have to build our nation but do it quietly without attracting too much attention from the super powers involved in the region. We need to build up more infrastructure with Iran, we need to do many things including deepening our ties with Russia so they do not feel threatened by our increasing ties with other powers. This is pretty much what Serj has been doing and it shows in the form of increased businesses and opportunities on all fronts. The things people keep complaining about are oligarchies which i have explained many times are the natural byproduct of capitalism-they take all the profits leaving very little for most other people. This structure exists in every capitalist country. If this is what you want to change you have to change the economic system because if you change just the politicians then other oligarchs will simply fill the void and nothing really will change.

[gegev]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Serbia and Azerbadjan you say? What do they both have in common? Oh yeh they lost territories..Think about it. As for the likes of Gageve who enjoys living in a delusion any MMO maker would be jealous of, you say Armenians/Armenia survived for centuries without Russian ally like you mean before there was a Turkey? Like yeh sure we were kind of - sort of a power in the region thousends of years ago but that has no relevence now. Armenia has not been independent for so long that your comment is meaningless and hollow. There is no scenario in the present that has Armenia surviving wo Russia but yeh you go on and pretend that little resoursless Armenia is a superpower who can stand up to Turkey, Iran, Russia, USA, Europe, ..Most men over time understand that they are not invincible as they get older but time seems to have the opposite effect on you. londontsi finely said something i agree with " need to build a healthy state from within." yes this is exactly what we need to do and what i have been preaching all along but we have to do this under the radar because no one in the region wants a strong - independent Armenia. A strong Armenia is just another headache for the powers of the day to deal with so we have to build our nation but do it quietly without attracting too much attention from the super powers involved in the region. We need to build up more infrastructure with Iran, we need to do many things including deepening our ties with Russia so they do not feel threatened by our increasing ties with other powers. This is pretty much what Serj has been doing and it shows in the form of increased businesses and opportunities on all fronts. The things people keep complaining about are oligarchies which i have explained many times are the natural byproduct of capitalism-they take all the profits leaving very little for most other people. This structure exists in every capitalist country. If this is what you want to change you have to change the economic system because if you change just the politicians then other oligarchs will simply fill the void and nothing really will change.

Serbia/Yugoslavia; former Russian ally/partner and Azerbaijan; Russians Weapon-Deal partner, you say they both lost territories.
We may continue the list of the other Russian partners that you didn't mention ... Iraq (de facto divided between; Sunni, Sheit & Kurds) & Siria is on the edge of collapse.

Striking comparison!!!

Do you threaten Armenia as Russian's Strategic-partner? Because you claim that all countries, that are Russians partners are loosing territories, eventually!

I see you just discovered that Armenia had no statehood for 6 cneturies, good for you. But Armenians and their armed groups that joined Russian army during the wars; always had been there.

Hakakan, I guess, the $1,000,000,000 deal below, between Russia and Azeries, was difficult to argue further.

Talking "ally" instead of acting one.
This is the real Russia.

What matters in fact, are actions, groundless declarations on supporting Armenia, done by some second grade Russian officials, is the only benefit we got.

But even in the "talking" part they don't give full preference to Armenia, they support Armenians and Azeries "equally".

When the war breaks out and the Russian weapon above will destroy Armenia, they will condemn azery actions strongly. Enjoy our talking ally.

What we need now most is an acting ally, regardless how powerful it is, because even Turkey may serve for us as a talking ally, if asked.

I'd prefer one small acting ally over hundreds of powerful talking ones.

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

I see lots of comments about Russia being ally or not. Look at our military. Look at our economy. Run a comparison. If it was left to our ability, we would not be able to equip more than a brigade with our means in international markets.
Look at our military again. There must be a reason why we've got so much.
Russia is an ally.
But not only Russia, anybody else will keep an alliance only with right people, in right circumstances, not with idiots who do not loose an opportunity to loose an opportunity. Especially if it is heavily one way.
Don't be an idiot.
It is not the only question that we choose the right allies, but also we play the right games right way.
We have stabbed our allies( anybody does) just like we have been stabbed also. You've got to know when what, and be prepared of what's coming to you.

[gegev]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

I see lots of comments about Russia being ally or not. Look at our military. Look at our economy. Run a comparison. If it was left to our ability, we would not be able to equip even a brigade with our means in international markets. Look at our military again. There must be a reason that we've got so much.
Russia is an ally. But not only Russia, anybody else would keep an alliance only with right people, not idiots. Especially if it is heavily one way.
Don't be an idiot.
It is not the only question that we choose the right allies, but also we play the right games right way.
We have stabbed our allies( anybody does) just like we have been stabbed also. You've got to know when what. and be prepared of what's coming to you.

Reading the idiot-word I recognized at once that you are the wise.
I'm a humble human being, I don't argue with that wise.

[Hakob]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

Reading the idiot-word I recognized at once that you are the wise.
I'm a humble human being, I don't argue with that wise.

Gegev
The word "Idiot" applies to all of us, including me and you, if we, as a nation will not be able to translate and react to developments around us and loose opportunities that arise in our favor. Or worse, being steared by others.
This is not only about our foreign policies, but also internal. Our corruption and greed. Political ineptedness and lack of national will.
In other words, we have to realise that no ally will help or save us if we keep stearing our boat towards rocks.
I did not mean to insult you personally. Sorry.

[londontsi]

Re: Is Russia an ally or foe, nowadays?

.... The word "Idiot" applies to all of us, including me and you,.....

You sound a bit like Cory next door who is trying to save our souls.

http://forum.hyeclub.com/showthread.php/20364-Can-We-Trust-the-Bible?p=343175&viewfull=1#post343175

What's gone into everybody???