Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

[Persopolis]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

The Turkish Ghaznavids, who ruled most of eastern Iran in the 10th century, were invited in by the Abassid caliphate. They came from central Asia via Khorasan and western Afghanistan. The Seljuk Turks took the same route, first defeating the Ghaznavids, and by 1055 they were marching into Baghdad. Tughrul, leader of the Seljuks in Iran, then diverted further migrating Seljuk armies away from his own territories in Iran by encouraging them to move north and invade Armenia instead. No invasions of Iran came from the direction of Armenia.

At least your remarks were more intelligent than the others -- Here's the context in Chronological order:

1. I asserted that the Ottoman-Turks and Iran had military conflicts for which Armenia came into play. (The real subject matter at hand is the birth of children that occurs during military incursions, as being relevant to the subject of assimilation). http://www.armenica.org/cgi-bin/arme...=10=nada=1=3=A

2. The subsequent comment from "Haysip" was topical to the question of assimilation (changes in the Armenian gene pool) wherein he asserted "those babies that were not Armenian were being destroyed." In other words, he asserts that Armenians kept themselves "pure" of the genes of invaders.

3. One of the guys above (don't really want to waste my life identifying who) -- seemingly having nothing topical to write -- decided to assert that the Ottoman advance did not originate from West of Iran (where Ottoman-Turkey is actually located). In trying to keep close to the subject at hand I pointed out that others groups from the Northern caucuses also invaded Armenia (and made babies = let's call it 'genetic assimilation' for purposes of simplicity).

It's a tangential point, but what is funny is that my version is consistent with the Armenian version. Here's one example and you can find dozens more at the same link run by Armenica.org: http://www.armenica.org/cgi-bin/arme...=10=nada=1=3=A

FROM Armenica.org: "At the Armenian border, Sultan Mehmet II [of Ottoman Turkey lying to the West of Iran] encountered the Turkmen who controlled Persia and Armenia and consequently posed a threat to Asia Minor. He defeated the Turkmen army at Terjan, by the Euphrates River. The battle was bloody, probably the harshest which Sultan Mehmet II had yet experienced. The Ottomans won the battle mainly due to their larger number of canons. Thereby the Turkmen threat against Asia Minor was eradicated. By the time of his death, Sultan Mehmet II had expanded the Ottoman Empire as far as the present day Erzinjan. Only Armenia and Persia remained in Turkmen possession. Persia, however, with the emergence of the Sefevid Ismail Shah, pulled its forces together, defeated the Turkmen and liberated itself from foreign rule, expelling the Turks in 1472 not only from Persia, but also from Armenia."

A similar scenario also played out with Shah Abbas - but several of the characters above rely on the history lessons they were given in bars and bus stops (so it's not really worth responding to - I generally just ignore off-point remarks).

The real point is that there was modification of the gene pool inherent with various military incursions into Armenia -- i.e., the subject of this thread.

[ArmSurvival]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

It's a 2 way street - genes flow both ways.

So by that token, we can also claim that Iranians are part of Greater Armenia.

[haysip]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

... though really for this I need a smilie that is rolling around with side-splitting laughter! First time I've seen his idiot face though. For someone claiming that (if Haysip's summary is correct) the "Armenian genotype" today is exactly the same as it was 3000 years ago he looks more like an underfed Russian than a typical Armenian, and the woman after him looks like a decrepid old Persian peasant! Mind you, Hilter was far from his own ideal "Germanic genotype".

looks like u dont speak Armenian cuz he answered all your statements made in this quote, including about the German people...

[UrMistake]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

Persepolis we had many wars with ancient persia,and we had times of truce,it is more a matter of geopolitics something that maybe you have forgotten or dont know,that vary thing makes us different with the larger persian group ,ok lets no go further, many byzantine dynasties were armenian ones and clearly fought wars to secure armenian part of the empire.

Take example of europeans,it is fact that every 100 years so far they have wars it is natural,cause they are different with each other but they have found a common language.

[Persopolis]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

So by that token, we can also claim that Iranians are part of Greater Armenia.

You can claim anything you want - convincing 80 million Iranians is another task. Read the earlier quote I made to someone on the topic below:

Though Mos knows little about Iran apart from the standard Zionist propaganda he constantly spouts off about Iranians -- he wants to propagate that nonsense without the participation of Iranians while pushing a myth that we are going to jump through the computer screen and deprive Armenia of self-rule by creating a "Greater Iran." It's a phony scare tactic typical of the Zionist lobby.

[Persopolis]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

Persepolis we had many wars with ancient persia,and we had times of truce,it is more a matter of geopolitics something that maybe you have forgotten or dont know,that vary thing makes us different with the larger persian group ,ok lets no go further, many byzantine dynasties were armenian ones and clearly fought wars to secure armenian part of the empire.

Take example of europeans,it is fact that every 100 years so far they have wars it is natural,cause they are different with each other but they have found a common language.

This thread is about family relationships / DNA / Assimilation: Title = "Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?" The Only Topical Comments & Responses are at Posts 1 & 15-18.

[Eddo211]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

these 2 persians.

estrang Parsic chen.....Iran is a very multi-ethnic groups with centuries of intermixing which makes up Iranians. True Persian are now down to 45%. Throw in Arab factor with religion then you can get an Idea.

We Armenian in Iran have never been in that mix and have always managed to maintain our own unique ancient roots from our way of life. It has been objective number one, ask any Paskahay who has been an adult in Iran.

We look different as well against our Persian friends and the Iranians can tell right away from looks (most of the time) that we are Armenians. We also speak Farsi with a strong Armenian accent.

[Mos]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

estrang Parsic chen.....Iran is a very multi-ethnic groups with centuries of intermixing which makes up Iranians. True Persian are now down to 45%. Throw in Arab factor with religion then you can get an Idea.

We Armenian in Iran have never been in that mix and have always managed to maintain our own unique ancient roots from our way of life. It has been objective number one, ask any Paskahay who has been an adult in Iran.

We look different as well against our Persian friends and the Iranians can tell right away from looks (most of the time) that we are Armenians. We also speak Farsi with a strong Armenian accent.

yes, you make a good point...

[Persopolis]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

Iran is a very multi-ethnic groups with centuries of intermixing which makes up Iranians. True Persian are now down to 45%.

In Iran, we love all of national minorities; I'd say the 2 most distinct groups are the Shia-Arabs in the South-West (near where you lived) and a small town of Turkmen on the border with Turkmenistan -- Iran is a huge place. Most of the other Iranians are pretty much native tribes of Iran-Zamin. I'm not worried about having 43% Persians or 42% (that's still between 30-35 million people); But I don't believe those figures anyway because they are generated from outside the country (you would have to rely on a domestic census). Nevertheless, I love that Iran has been so influential (if you count our diaspora & mixed-marriages we're easily 200+ million. )

Iranians aren't confused about who they are -- we have pictures of each tribal group going back thousands of years:



It happens all of the time: Mahaya Petrossian actually moved to London and found an Iranian guy there ... I wish her happiness.

LONDON, October 24 (IranMania) - The well-known Armenian actress of Iranian origin, Mahaya Petrossian converted to Shia Islam last week. According to the Sunday issue of the Persian morning daily of Tosse'e quoting Khurshid website, she converted to Islam following her marriage to a Muslim young man. Speaking to Khurshid reporter, she confirmed the report and said that she had been in doubt for a long time whether to remain a Christian or convert to Islam. "However, what happened in my personal life, namely my marriage to a Muslim man, put an end to my doubt and I eventually became a Muslim," added the actress.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Are Iranian-Armenians Iranian? What is Armenian Assimilation?

At least your remarks were more intelligent than the others -- Here's the context in Chronological order:

1. I asserted that the Ottoman-Turks and Iran had military conflicts for which Armenia came into play. (The real subject matter at hand is the birth of children that occurs during military incursions, as being relevant to the subject of assimilation). http://www.armenica.org/cgi-bin/arme...=10=nada=1=3=A

2. The subsequent comment from "Haysip" was topical to the question of assimilation (changes in the Armenian gene pool) wherein he asserted "those babies that were not Armenian were being destroyed." In other words, he asserts that Armenians kept themselves "pure" of the genes of invaders.

3. One of the guys above (don't really want to waste my life identifying who) -- seemingly having nothing topical to write -- decided to assert that the Ottoman advance did not originate from West of Iran (where Ottoman-Turkey is actually located). In trying to keep close to the subject at hand I pointed out that others groups from the Northern caucuses also invaded Armenia (and made babies = let's call it 'genetic assimilation' for purposes of simplicity).

It's a tangential point, but what is funny is that my version is consistent with the Armenian version. Here's one example and you can find dozens more at the same link run by Armenica.org: http://www.armenica.org/cgi-bin/arme...=10=nada=1=3=A



A similar scenario also played out with Shah Abbas - but several of the characters above rely on the history lessons they were given in bars and bus stops (so it's not really worth responding to - I generally just ignore off-point remarks).

The real point is that there was modification of the gene pool inherent with various military incursions into Armenia -- i.e., the subject of this thread.

1. Now you are trying to change what you said, you said that Armenia was the easiest way to attack Iran and implied that Turkish tribes and Arabs used Armenia to invade Iran.
2.I went ahead and searched the definition of assimilation for you, because to me it seems you do not know what assimilation means and it has nothing to do with the genes at all. Shocking isn't it?

as·sim·i·la·tion (-sm-lshn)
n.
1.
a. The act or process of assimilating.
b. The state of being assimilated.
2. Physiology The conversion of nutriments into living tissue; constructive metabolism.
3. Linguistics The process by which a sound is modified so that it becomes similar or identical to an adjacent or nearby sound. For example, the prefix in- becomes im- in impossible by assimilation to the labial p of possible.
4. The process whereby a minority group gradually adopts the customs and attitudes of the prevailing culture.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/assimilation

3.the quote that you have posted has nothing to do with what you said. You never said one of the things that has been said in the quote. You love pulling things out of your ass don't you?

You're point is that Armenians are Iranians and should be part of Greater Iran, that's the point you are trying to make not that there was a modification of the gene pool or anything else.