Vive La France !!!!!

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

if the only time someone thinks they have to tell the truth is when they are under oath they are morally bankrupt. People who think the world is flat are ignorant(it's hard to fix stupid). Your confusion as to (where do we draw the line )is telling.----- you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink----/Artashes

Morality has nothing to do here. You made a very stupid statement and where caught lying and are now trying to weasel yourself out of it. So where is the proof for your last statement? And I'm not confused at all, I'm just asking the people that believe there is a need for limits, where we draw the line.

KarotheGreat , firstly i don't live in US and i don't give a xxxx about the US amendments and all i'm in Europe,what US has for law it will not make it also a universal one ok? the way of your thinking shows great american arrogance,the law is passed in France and its about what ever happens in there soil.
US and others ps. like you shows arrogance of what is freedom of speach and how it can be used against others.
For better understanding of the matter you should see how governments treat some religious sects or how they try to prevent one to be spread to its population for 1,2,3, reasons.
All the Laws are a tool to determine of how we like to live in our country.

I'm very sad that u support turkish side ,cause it hearts only them what this has to do with your freedom of speech ? are you gonna say Genocide is a lie too? or are you our new Captain America guy?

I live right next to France so I have every right to complain against this law, especially if there is a chance that this becomes a law around the whole of the European Union.
I have said it before and I will repeat myself: if you don't like what I write then that is your problem. I will not stop writing because you have a problem with it. I am also against the treatment of religious sects, freedom of religion should be something universal as well. No government should ever have the power to tell us what is right or wrong to believe.
Yes laws are tools to determine how we like to live in a country, and I have the right to fight any law that I think is wrong.
So I should forget about my principles and become a sheep and follow the crowd because that is the cool thing to do? If I wanted to say it I should have the right to do it!
And al those personal attacks show how much merit your argument has.

Approval and laws are different things.

There is a clear difference between executive decisions ( e.g. approval) and laws set by parliament.

Parliament has a duty to explain to the public as to why a particular law is created, typically through public debate.

You still haven't answered my question.

If we are serious about freedom of speech and democracy then we cannot allow institutions misuse that freedom of speech as pretext and a tool to change history and piss all over us by this well oiled denialist political machine. I hope it does pass because it will be a blow to Ankara.

Taner Ackam has it right:

This will do nothing against Ankara except that they will gain more popularity in Turkey. I don't see how this is a blow against Turkey, it only shows that some people are willing to do anything to smother everything that doesn't agree with their view. I want to fight the trukish propaganda machine, go and study history, research the genocide and release papers, write books about the subject make the people hear your view. There is a right way to do things and there is a wrong way.
Laws like this have the power to stop historical debate on any subject. How long until governments pass laws that it is illegal to discuss their view on history on any subject possible?

Amen!

A few people on this thread/forum post examples of turcish propaganda, post links to turc propaganda, seem to believe turc propaganda. It may surprise some people but not everyone sees the USA as the promised land.

In my view, if it walks like a turc, talks like a turc, it's probably a turc.

Yes personal attacks towards people who don't agree with you show how much merit your arguments have. Your are the same as your enemy the only difference is the paint coat.

exactly
if people haven't noticed, the American system is not perfect. Furthermore, the American freedom of speech has very strong limits on libel, slander, hate speech, and much more. It's like the morons who claim they can say whatever they want in a work or school environment, because they have a freedom of speech. There is nothing unconstitutional about a law that stops liars intentionally spreading hateful propaganda to dilute the minds of innocent bystanders and smearing basic historic and scientific facts.

Can you show me where the United States has stopped hate speech? If an organization as the Westboro Baptist church is allowed to exist it shows that hate speech is not a problem in the US. Any private organization can do as they please however it is not up to government to tell us what is true or isn't and what we can say and what we can't!
Again the liar argument, you don't see this as a slippery slope do you? Where any country can chose what is the truth and start punishing those that don't agree with them. Let's say tomorrow Germany passes a law say Khojali happened like the Azeris say and anybody that denies it will go to jail for 10 years! Does that not sound retarded to you?

You want to defeat the Turks, use their own game against them. Go and defeat them in the public forum, prove to the world that they are lying but the thing that we shouldn't do is turn in to them!

[UrMistake]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

KarotheGreat yes i posted in anger but most of my points were legit,i never wanted to hurt you personally im sorry if i did so.
I'm targeting towards the people that react to such law and for my sadness i can see that the next good thing for armenia ...,and to put into realization of what the turks and muslims are doing to europe you are against the spread of the law into other european or non nations.
This is good for THE VICTIMS and no i'm not into having all kinds of religious sect running in the streets and recruiting stupid people , cause stupid people will do and believe in such.

Now i got my own religion named the Flying Octopus and we like to spread lies do you want to join? We also believe that the 2012 is the end of the world so will do group suicides wanna join? What you say no ? well ok il go talk to some other folks cause i got the freedom to do so...

[hrai]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

I live right next to France so I have every right to complain against this law, especially if there is a chance that this becomes a law around the whole of the European Union.

Right next to France, but not in France. if this law becomes pan-European you should lobby your MEP. As Artashes said " if you don't like it , get the eff out of Dodge".

So I should forget about my principles and become a sheep and follow the crowd because that is the cool thing to do? If I wanted to say it I should have the right to do it!

How many people follow their principles all the way to their grave?

And al those personal attacks show how much merit your argument has.

There was no personal attack there, just an observation but if it touched a nerve there's not much I can do. As the saying goes "If the coat fits, wear it."

As regards "freedom" of expression, freedom of religious practice, freedom of thought, freedom of movement, freedom from unfair taxation and unfair laws, freedom of the media. Go and live in musselman lands and see how long people last expressing their wish for these freedoms.

Unfortunately society sometimes has to deny certain freedoms to it's citizens "for the greater good".

Does that not sound retarded to you?

You have a fixation with the words : retard,retarded........................not the best choice surely ??

You want to defeat the Turks, use their own game against them. Go and defeat them in the public forum, prove to the world that they are lying but the thing that we shouldn't do is turn in to them!

Interesting that you say "You want to defeat the turcs" not WE. But you are definitely right that we shouldn't turn into them.

[hrai]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

Just a thought: If their is any one in the world that seeks to be an person of honor and does not want to hear a mature responsible adult tell them to shut the f?ck up then the should not say things that warrant that/Artashes

Artashes, I think you're the only person to use the word "morals" in this thread. Sign of the times I suppose that everyone's getting their pants knotted over this law with what's legal and what isn't but more importantly "what's moral ?".

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

Right next to France, but not in France. if this law becomes pan-European you should lobby your MEP. As Artashes said " if you don't like it , get the eff out of Dodge".

I will fight this in any way I see fit, that is one of the beauties of freedom.

How many people follow their principles all the way to their grave?

What is the worth of a man that doesn't follow his own principles in life?

As regards "freedom" of expression, freedom of religious practice, freedom of thought, freedom of movement, freedom from unfair taxation and unfair laws, freedom of the media. Go and live in musselman lands and see how long people last expressing their wish for these freedoms.

So you want us to be like them now? You want us to give up our freedoms because they don't have it? Two wrongs do not make a right!

Unfortunately society sometimes has to deny certain freedoms to it's citizens "for the greater good".

How does achieve greater good? Some people who don't matter are silenced and some people can do a circlejerk and tell each other that they achieved something great. So what is this greater good you are talking about? Because I don't us Armenians getting justice because of this.

You have a fixation with the words : retard,retarded........................not the best choice surely ??

If you have a problem with it take it up with the moderation and let them decide if it is against the rules of the forum to use the word.

Interesting that you say "You want to defeat the turcs" not WE. But you are definitely right that we shouldn't turn into them.

Maybe because I am addressing him and his statement.

I also wonder how long until laws like this will be used against Armenians?




[QUOTE=UrMistake;328106]KarotheGreat yes i posted in anger but most of my points were legit,i never wanted to hurt you personally im sorry if i did so.
I'm targeting towards the people that react to such law and for my sadness i can see that the next good thing for armenia ...,and to put into realization of what the turks and muslims are doing to europe you are against the spread of the law into other european or non nations.[quote]
This law does more harm to Europe than Turks or Muslims ever could do. When we give up our freedoms what difference is there between us and them?

This is good for THE VICTIMS and no i'm not into having all kinds of religious sect running in the streets and recruiting stupid people , cause stupid people will do and believe in such.

How many of those victims are alive today? You aren't a victim neither am I nor anyone posting on this side is a victim. The same way I am not a victim because my great grandfather was send to the gulags.

Now i got my own religion named the Flying Octopus and we like to spread lies do you want to join? We also believe that the 2012 is the end of the world so will do group suicides wanna join? What you say no ? well ok il go talk to some other folks cause i got the freedom to do so...

To me this doesn't sound any different or ridiculous than any of the other religions. Prove me that your flying octopus exists and I will join. And you can recruit who ever you want, if someone is dumb enough to believe it to something like this they get what they deserve.

[hrai]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

Morality has nothing to do here.

Disgusting.

[hrai]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

I will fight this in any way I see fit, that is one of the beauties of freedom.

That'll be limited to a keyboard then.

What is the worth of a man that doesn't follow his own principles in life?

What worth that man whose principles take his family to the grave?

So you want us to be like them now? You want us to give up our freedoms because they don't have it? Two wrongs do not make a right!

I would go even further than this law proposes to actually.

If you have a problem with it take it up with the moderation and let them decide if it is against the rules of the forum to use the word.

I don't have a problem with those words, they probably highlight your mentality.

I also wonder how long until laws like this will be used against Armenians?

hasn't that already happened?

How many of those victims are alive today? You aren't a victim neither am I nor anyone posting on this side is a victim. The same way I am not a victim because my great grandfather was send to the gulags.

Totally totally disgusting.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

Disgusting.

Yes because morality is something absolute or is it the fact that you want to push your own morality down people's throats?

That'll be limited to a keyboard then.

This BS doesn't even deserve any answer!

What worth that man whose principles take his family to the grave?

So how will defending freedom of speech do this.

I would go even further than this law proposes to actually.

Basic human rights mean nothing to you? Or is it only when you are affected?

I don't have a problem with those words, they probably highlight your mentality.

Like I said before personal attacks only show the weakness of your "arguments" (if you even can call them that)

hasn't that already happened?

It has and now you are supporting the same thing. How does that make you any better them?

Totally totally disgusting.

Do you consider yourself a victim? The only people who can demand something like this are the victims of the genocide not us!

[hrai]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

The only people who can demand something like this are the victims of the genocide not us!

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Vive La France !!!!!

What does mean?