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Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

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  • #51
    Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

    Originally posted by hrai View Post
    Denial of genocide is a stage of and continuation of that genocide. turcs and their brother baboons continued genocide in baku, sumgait etc. Our heroes in Artsakh helped stop this.

    You obviously didn't read that I wrote " a large muslim population" and you obviously don't know the history of the first Armenian republic.

    That is a ridiculous statement. Ask the african countires who trade with China, ask India how mutually beneficial the trade was with Britain in the British Empire.



    Amazing that you consider the rights of the residents of this land in 2012 but seem to dismiss THE SAME RIGHTS for the residents and their descendants of 1915.

    Reducing a claim for land reclamation to tourist hot-spots? There seems to be a desire to have Armenia as a sort of Theme Park, a destination on your must-do-list.

    I suggest you research the history of your country.
    Call it whatever you want.

    I never said large, I said majority. Besides, first republic was in the early days when Armenians and Muslims had less problems. I don't know about you, but I would not be OK with the idea that my Homeland is Muslim-majority.

    I explained this earlier, but trade is by definition mutually beneficial. If it wasn't, then why would their be trade at all? India's relationship with China was different, because India was a colony (a continuation of the empire). As such, you don't trade with your own country, you take the things that you need.

    I acknowledge everyone's rights. But realistically speaking, what are you going to do? Tell all the Turks to leave? In your head, can you even picture how this whole process would unfold?

    You clearly know nothing about Armenia whatsoever if you refer to Ararat and Ani as tourist hotspots. I'll take it as poor word choice, but if it's not then I won't bother explaining anyway. Regardless, my rationale is that we would not be dealing with the problem of self-determination (as those areas are sparsely if at all populated).
    Last edited by davidoga; 07-05-2012, 03:57 AM.

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    • #52
      Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

      Originally posted by davidoga View Post
      Call it whatever you want.

      I never said large, I said majority. Besides, first republic was in the early days when Armenians and Muslims had less problems. I don't know about you, but I would not be OK with the idea that my Homeland is Muslim-majority.
      that is so ridiculous a statement to make.

      I explained this earlier, but trade is by definition mutually beneficial. If it wasn't, then why would their be trade at all? India's relationship with China was different, because India was a colony (a continuation of the empire). As such, you don't trade with your own country, you take the things that you need.
      I spoke of Africa/China and India/Britain as trading areas, not India/China............................are you confused here?

      I acknowledge everyone's rights. But realistically speaking, what are you going to do? Tell all the Turks to leave? In your head, can you even picture how this whole process would unfold?
      Yes.

      You clearly know nothing about Armenia whatsoever if you refer to Ararat and Ani as tourist hotspots.
      Ararat & Ani would become tourist hotspots with the border open. I clearly no nothing about a mountain I saw from my bedroom window every morning.

      I'll take it as poor word choice, but if it's not then I won't bother explaining anyway. Regardless, my rationale is that we would not be dealing with the problem of self-determination (as those areas are sparsely if at all populated).
      Are you aware why "those areas are sparsely if at all populated"?

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      • #53
        Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

        Originally posted by davidoga View Post

        Besides, first republic was in the early days when Armenians and Muslims had less problems.
        This has to be one of the most ignorant sentences ever posted on this site.

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        • #54
          Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

          Davidd ur posts are full of fail ,you should know more about armenia

          Comment

          • #55
            Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

            Originally posted by hrai View Post
            that is so ridiculous a statement to make.

            I spoke of Africa/China and India/Britain as trading areas, not India/China............................are you confused here?

            Yes.

            Ararat & Ani would become tourist hotspots with the border open. I clearly no nothing about a mountain I saw from my bedroom window every morning.

            Are you aware why "those areas are sparsely if at all populated"?
            "Ask India how mutually beneficial the trade was with Britain in the British Empire." That is what you said. Don't try to BS me, at least not on a forum where I can pull up what you said. I never said anything about India/China relationship. You are the confused one.

            Ok, if you have such plan, how would you go about addressing the problem that Western Armenia is Turk Muslim dominated?

            I am fully aware that Ararat and Ani would become tourist spots. We should hope so! Bring in lots of money. But that is irrelevant. You accused me of wanting the tourist areas back, which is not the case. If that is all that Ararat and Ani mean to you, then so be it.

            Of course I know. Those areas were Armenian populated until the genocides of the 19th and 20th centuries. What is your point?

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            • #56
              Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

              Originally posted by hrai View Post
              This has to be one of the most ignorant sentences ever posted on this site.
              You're right, I misspoke. I as referring to Satrapy Armenia and Antiquity Kingdom. I am aware that Democratic Republic of Armenia had many issues. Regardless, Democratic Republic of Armenia was a failed state. Your reference to it does not validate your argument whatsoever.
              Last edited by davidoga; 07-05-2012, 06:38 AM.

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              • #57
                Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

                Originally posted by davidoga View Post
                I am aware that Democratic Republic of Armenia had many issues.
                Regardless, Democratic Republic of Armenia was a failed state.

                Democratic Republic of Armenia was not a failed state.

                On the contrary despite its massive difficulties it put up a fight to maintain its sovereignty.
                It succumbed to invading forces much stronger than itself.

                A failed state is when the state internally collapses has usually no external enemies, a good example is Somalia.
                Internal rule of law and governing institutions stop functioning.
                Despite that no other country is trying to conquer it.
                Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
                Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
                Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

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                • #58
                  Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

                  Originally posted by londontsi View Post
                  Democratic Republic of Armenia was not a failed state.

                  On the contrary despite its massive difficulties it put up a fight to maintain its sovereignty.
                  It succumbed to invading forces much stronger than itself.

                  A failed state is when the state internally collapses has usually no external enemies, a good example is Somalia.
                  Internal rule of law and governing institutions stop functioning.
                  Despite that no other country is trying to conquering it.
                  I was not using the textbook definition. Democratic Republic of Armenia as a de jure independent state would be detrimental to Armenia in the long run. Do you really think that the Turkish and Azeri enemies would have spared Armenia if it had not been for Soviet Union. In other words, its collapse was a good thing.

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                  • #59
                    Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

                    Originally posted by davidoga View Post
                    I was not using the textbook definition.
                    Yes I know ... you were characterizing it inaccurately.

                    Originally posted by davidoga View Post
                    Democratic Republic of Armenia as a de jure independent state would be detrimental to Armenia in the long run.
                    Do you really think that the Turkish and Azeri enemies would have spared Armenia if it had not been for Soviet Union.
                    I cannot tell, probably not, specially if they found an good opportunity to pursue their Pan Turanism agenda.

                    My view is that the being part of the Soviet Union was a mixed bag.
                    Very bad to start with ( till Stalin's death ), somewhat better after that.

                    ( This reminds me of the joke, “The good thing about being hit on the head with a hammer is that you start feeling good when it is stopped.)

                    Originally posted by davidoga View Post
                    In other words, its collapse was a good thing.
                    The Government collapsed ...... not the country ..... despite all its difficulties.
                    Politics is not about the pursuit of morality nor what's right or wrong
                    Its about self interest at personal and national level often at odds with the above.
                    Great politicians pursue the National interest and small politicians personal interests

                    Comment

                    • #60
                      Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

                      I clearly no nothing about a mountain I saw from my window every morning ---
                      Man you are killing me. (big smile from last frontier)
                      Artashes

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