Religion and Atheism

[KanadaHye]

Re: Religion and Atheism

You have to copy and paste the link and replace the xxx with you know what but it's about a 500+ page history of somewhat reliable sources.

[Haykakan]

Re: Religion and Atheism

Your first link dont work well it leads to nowhere anyways. Ill have to listen to the rest of those links later but i can say without reservations that no one has suffered more then Armenians because of religion.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Religion and Atheism

Let's see what happened the last time people tried to "get rid of religion"

THE J3wISH GENOCIDE OF ARMENIAN CHRISTIANS

http://www.xxxishracism.com/xxxish_G...e_Enlarged.pdf

But you see, they failed, and they failed miserably because they messed with the wrong race.

Here are a couple videos of this authors interview (is also of j3wish descent)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...16189423072580
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...74640042234806

[Haykakan]

Re: Religion and Atheism

That said, I think if there was no religion, we'd find just another reason to justify acts of violence and aggression toward others and different bases on which to create our "in-group."

That is true but there is nothing as effective as religion for those spreading evile and hate. The alternatives are way less effective and combining groups outside of racial lines would be a lot harder without religion. Getting rid of religion will elliminate the best tools bad people have at their disposal for doing bad things and there are no alternatives that come close to this one for being effective on a massive scale. At the same time the good derived from religion is rather scetchy, sure some good has come of it but where were our fellow chrystians during our genocide? Religion has created a false sence of security especially for us Armenians and we have paid for it dearly. When you take into account all the pluses and minuses religion just doesnt add up.

[Siggie]

Re: Religion and Atheism

I agree that religion is not inherintly evile and it is people who use it for evile but i will strongly disagree that it is effective in controling evile tendencies, i would instead argue that no tool has ever been more effectively used like religion has been for justifying evile tendencies. Sure they may have used something else to justify their actions if not for religion but the fact that they chose religion means that it was the most effective tool at their disposal. Religion is too good at propogating evile and spreading ignorence, so good in fact that it is and has been the tool of choice for evile doers.

I'm jumping in here not having read the last few pages, but I agree with this...
A lot of evil has been done in the name of religion. It is used as just one more way to create differences between people. It's a lot easier to hurt others, especially face to face, when you can dehumanize them. Religious belief is another way to see someone as sufficiently different from oneself thus making it easier to commit acts of violence against them.
That said, I think if there was no religion, we'd find just another reason to justify acts of violence and aggression toward others and different bases on which to create our "in-group."

Science itself has "created" elements to place on the periodic table which don't exist in nature. To boast that everything came from nothing is no more or no less absurd than to believe that there is/are greater sources of intelligence which created our existence. Strict evolutionary teachings has created an entire generation of students who believe in nothing, and lack creativity and the vision to think with their minds and hands. I've seen these clowns enter the workforce and within a week start accumulating injury reports. They are pretty much useless as far as skills go and should just stick to taking liberal arts classes and working at walmart stocking shelves.

This is all over the place. The fact that there are created elements doesn't mean much. I suggest actually looking at what those elements are and how they act because they only exist a very short period of time after being created precisely for that reason. There's no created element that we can make and release that continues to exist. That's really neither here nor there though...I can create a pie too, but I fail to see how that supports "Intelligent" Design/Creationism. And the alternative is not exactly that everything came from nothing. Science doesn't have all of the answers to all questions and it's okay with that because if it did our work would be done already. We are still figuring out what happened within the tiniest fractions of seconds following the big bang. We don't know what was there right before it. Don't know yet is different from thinking there was nothing there. It's easy to misrepresent and twist something in order to disagree with it, but if what you were doing was truly a critical thinking exercise and an effort at applying reason to evaluate the arguments and see which is the better supported view, then you'd put forth the effort to understand both sides and look at strengths and weaknesses of each rather than only the one you set out to knock-down because that would allow bias to trump reason.

[hipeter924]

Re: Religion and Atheism

Science itself has "created" elements to place on the periodic table which don't exist in nature. To boast that everything came from nothing is no more or no less absurd than to believe that there is/are greater sources of intelligence which created our existence. Strict evolutionary teachings has created an entire generation of students who believe in nothing, and lack creativity and the vision to think with their minds and hands. I've seen these clowns enter the workforce and within a week start accumulating injury reports. They are pretty much useless as far as skills go and should just stick to taking liberal arts classes and working at walmart stocking shelves.

Evolution and the creation of the universe are two different theories. One for what happens when life is created and one for the creation of the universe itself; the flaw (and debate) is of course the in between; how do you get from creation of the universe to the creation of life?

Well the truth is that we will never find the answer to the beginning of the universe and what caused our existence whether you follow science or religion, for religion though you have to die to see whether creationist theory is true ; as for science the theory of the universe and life would probably be so complex that we will never likely be able to find the answer.

As for the lack of creativity and believing in nothing part, consumerism and the money, status and power culture is to blame for that one; people don't want to be creative or to believe in things as they want money, power and status and anyone who doesn't is considered a failure or an outcast.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Religion and Atheism

Well there will always be some kind of spiritual or religious belief, it might be insane or retarded; but people still believe the earth is flat. Creationism is effectively the same, some go a step further and say we don't exist or that we are just a bunch of gas clouds floating in nothingness. But calling creationism 'science', that's silly. It's one thing to claim evolution is false and think there is a better theory, but quite another to put one even worse (and more flaky in evidence) in its place.

Science itself has "created" elements to place on the periodic table which don't exist in nature. To boast that everything came from nothing is no more or no less absurd than to believe that there is/are greater sources of intelligence which created our existence. Strict evolutionary teachings has created an entire generation of students who believe in nothing, and lack creativity and the vision to think with their minds and hands. I've seen these clowns enter the workforce and within a week start accumulating injury reports. They are pretty much useless as far as skills go and should just stick to taking liberal arts classes and working at walmart stocking shelves.

[Armanen]

Re: Religion and Atheism

I agree that religion is not inherintly evile and it is people who use it for evile but i will strongly disagree that it is effective in controling evile tendencies, i would instead argue that no tool has ever been more effectively used like religion has been for justifying evile tendencies. Sure they may have used something else to justify their actions if not for religion but the fact that they chose religion means that it was the most effective tool at their disposal. Religion is too good at propogating evile and spreading ignorence, so good in fact that it is and has been the tool of choice for evile doers.

On the latter part we will have to agree to disagree because like I said, this convo isn't going to go anywhere with either of us sticking to our points.

[Haykakan]

Re: Religion and Atheism

This is the same as saying guns are evil blah blah blah, when it is infact the people who wield the guns and do terrible things are the evil ones. Religion in and of itself is not bad, but you can not seem to grasp that people will do terrible things to one another regardless of religion, they will always have something to justify their actions. Human nature has more to do with this than religion, which in fact helps to control the evil tendencies within us all.

I agree that religion is not inherintly evile and it is people who use it for evile but i will strongly disagree that it is effective in controling evile tendencies, i would instead argue that no tool has ever been more effectively used like religion has been for justifying evile tendencies. Sure they may have used something else to justify their actions if not for religion but the fact that they chose religion means that it was the most effective tool at their disposal. Religion is too good at propogating evile and spreading ignorence, so good in fact that it is and has been the tool of choice for evile doers.

[Armanen]

Re: Religion and Atheism

I am upset with religion because i believe it does more harm then good to humanity. From catholic schoolboys who cant walk straight to muslim women who had their xxxxts cut out-religion is full of the most vial things one human can do to another. Religion is used to justify all kinds of abuses, theft, rape, torture, genocide...all done in the name of religion-yet you still need to ask me why i am upset at religion? Creationism is a joke and if you do not understand why it is a joke then the education system has failed you miserably. Maybe your ok with living in a society that hails a joke as the law of life but i am not.

This is the same as saying guns are evil blah blah blah, when it is infact the people who wield the guns and do terrible things are the evil ones. Religion in and of itself is not bad, but you can not seem to grasp that people will do terrible things to one another regardless of religion, they will always have something to justify their actions. Human nature has more to do with this than religion, which in fact helps to control the evil tendencies within us all.